Bombing of Brno 1944 - 1945

[bigpetr]

Here is map of bomb attack led by Allied forces in Brno, Czech Republic, during WW2. Sites with little camera icon has historical photos. It can be good reference for diorama builders.

http://gis.brno.cz/ags/bomby/

 

[zathros]

Geeze, a lot of those pictures look like normal home and buildings. I guess they bombed based on Military Intelligence, (an Oxymoron, I know) or just bombed the shit out of everything!!

Was this considered a successful bombing (bearing in mind a A dead NAZI is a good NAZI)?

 

[bigpetr]

You are right - most of it was normal homes and civilian buildings.
Brno was located deep in Third Reich, far from front, not so many Nazi soldiers there. Targets was supposed to be main train station (important railway knot) and important industrial facilities, to harm economy and war industry - and they were damaged. So from that point it was sucesfull bombing. But most of people killed was not nazis or germans, but original citizens of occupied country.

In 1944 USAAF (Headquarters of 8th USA Air Force in Italy) made four bombing raids. Two of them had exact strategicaly important targets like city main train station, armory and industry targets. But wast areas of surrounding civilian buildings were also hit.

One of them bombarded historical center of the city (no industrial facilities what so ever, only civilian buildings, churches and theaters) - reasons for that are not known.

But the heawiest fourth bombing raid from 20th november 1944 was carpet bombing. It was not initialy planned as carpet bombing and American pilots apologized for it in 1945.

In 1945 city was bombarded by "liberatory" Red army airforce. In that times city was on front line and was prepared for land fight. Baricades and trenches was made in the city. Bombing aimed at strategical targets but collateral damages were also very high.

 

[zathros]

War sucks. This is why the U.S. and other countries have developed bombs that have an accuracy that can be measured in inches, launched from 1000's of miles away. Right now U.S. troops take out terrorists and destroy their homes, down to rubble, g in, identify the targets with DNA evidence, and nothing surrounding them is hit, though unfortunately, people do become collateral damage (killed) when they knowing, or unknowingly, put themselves in harm's way. I do not have any friends that are terrorists or criminals. I know criminals, but do not socialize with them. If they go down, I will have nothing to do with it, and I would turn in to the authorities anyone trying to harm somebody else in a New York minute, or prevent it myself, which I have done many times. Trouble follows me sometimes, I don't know why, maybe because I notice it?

 

[Cybergrinder]

True what you say Zathros, the thing to remember (does not condone it) was the bomb accuracy (or lack there-of) of WW2 bombs resulted in the "standard" way of bombing a target was carpet bombing. Only when RAF 617 squadron started experimenting with prescision bombing did the seeds of today's smart bombs get sown.

 

[zathros]

This is so very true, just as true is that America will never fight a war of attrition again. With the new accurate weapons, we can bomb out the respective villains, and let the people rebuild their own countries. It's easier to help them with that than to occupy, especially in places that want your help, not your boots on their soil. Hard cold new reality, of which I certainly am no expert.

 

[Cybergrinder]

Valid point, but would ISIS have risen to the power it has if NATO had stayed in Iraq longer? Just putting it out there as a discussion topic....

 

[zathros]

NATO needs to be enlarged,, and the participating countries pay their part. See how much Poland and Turkey give as part of their GDP. It should make most of Europe ashamed. We need to remove the colonial borders, better said, let the people remove those borders, which were usually dictated by land barriers, like mountain ranges, and let them duke it out, let these countries solver their internal struggles without others intervening. We had our civil war. We don't need to fight anyone elses. Groups like ISIS, Al Qaeda, are international stateless criminals, and have no rights under any treaty or government. They are open game, to be shot on sight. IMHO.

 

[Cybergrinder]

The only problem with no intervention is examples like the Wiemar Republic becoming Nazi Germany...

I do agree with your viewpoint regarding ISIS, etc..

 

[zathros]

I don't have a no intervention mentality, I have a "not overstaying, and having a plan and exit strategy" before we act. Big difference. I definitely that there are unfortunately, many times, and many more coalitions of good meaning people that will have to act for the betterment of the world's peoples. Not Halliburton though, and the corporate war machine is one of the parts that screws up good intentions. I'm simplifying this of course.

 

[zathros]

I think we're both on the same page about this. When you talk this kind of stuff out with people who actually listen to current events, they always seem to come to the same conclusions.

 

[Cybergrinder]

Very true, funny thing is I generally don't follow current events, to depressing. If we don't learn from history we will be doomed to repeat it. Reading up on historical encounters you can guess at what will happen

 

[zathros]

Past is prologue. Current evens are kind of obvious, just lift your head up, listen to what the mob groans, and you get a sense of what's going on.

 

[Cybergrinder]

LOL, you don't live in SA Issues you thought were resolved become issues 20+ years later...

And people's inablity to see long term is always an issue. Today coal truck drivers blockaded Pretoria to protest the government's plan to use of nuclear power. We have an energy crisis here were during peak times sometimes there is only 97-98% supply....

 

[Markus Schweizer]

Sometimes the things that happened in the past can affect us in our current life. Two of our neighbour cities here in the southwest of Germany
were also bombed heavily in WWII because of a military airfield, plane production companies, a main railway line, the Mercedes factory for
cars and plane motors etc..
It was on February 24th this Year (2017), about 8 PM when my alarm-beeper from the voluntary fire-brigade rang. During construction works an excavator-operator had found a bomb from WWII in the ground near the railway station and next to a lot of houses.
Our job was to help the police to bring the people out of the area to a safe place and later be in waiting position while the specialists disarmed the bomb.
It took until about 1:15 AM to disarm it and transport it away.
Before they started the construction works, the area was examined with scanners and sensors and declared bomb-free...
They assume that because of the railway-tracks in the near surrounding the scanners were not able to discover the bomb a few meters under the ground.

http://feuerwehr-boeblingen.de/einsaetze/einsatzbericht/1602

In this picture You can almost see me, I am the one in the rear window.

http://feuerwehr-boeblingen.de/images/Einsatzkomponente/einsatzbilder/1602/1602-IMG_7570.JPG

Kind regards

Markus Schweizer

 

[zathros]

When I was around 12 years old, there was a section of the old G.E. factory that still had an active minefield behind it. Supposedly, it was cleared out after much protest. Unfortunately, the remnants of war are scattered all over the world.

 

[Cybergrinder]

True what you say, I'm just puzzled why minefields were laid on mainland USA....

 

[zathros]

They were worried about spies, and sabotage, right thru the cold war. Don't go up the Housatonic River to the backside of Sikorsky Aircraft, you won't make it far. There are marker buoys, and patrol boats, and they are armed. Likewise up the Connecticut River where General Dynamics builds the nuclear subs, (it's pretty wide there, you'd have to be an idiot to navigate close to the clearly visible subs), or the clearly visible ( and not visible) armed guards or General Electric, or any of the defense companies headquartered in this state. Pratt and Whitney is like a city unto itself!

 

[Cybergrinder]

That makes sense, my ignorance of US geography & strategic locations revealed!