Varnish

Discussion in 'Tips, Tutorials & Tools' started by Darth_Nerdious, May 25, 2004.

  1. Darth_Nerdious

    Darth_Nerdious New Member

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    Well, I tried to put together some simple models, but it looks like the sweat of my hands don't mix very well with ink ... Guess that's one of the reasons people spray a dull coat over the paper pieces BEFORE gluing them, right? :D

    I'd like to hear some advice on varnishes to use on paper models. I've seen locally some 3M stuff. Any tips or recommendations?

    Tks,

    DN
  2. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    DN,

    Use Matte Acrylic or just plain Matte spray. It can be found at all art stores, WalMarts and paint shops. It's what artists use to protect charcoal and water color paintings without affecting the color. It also makes wiping up glue goofs a simple matter rather than a traumatic model changing event.

    Best, Gil
  3. shoki2000

    shoki2000 Active Member

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    Any specific brands?
    I would preffer something already tried and proven.....
  4. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    DN,

    Krylon.

    Best, Gil
  5. Ajax

    Ajax Member

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    I just picked up a can of Krylon Brand Matte Finish from Wal-Mart and Gil's sig took on a whole new meaning... I got carded for buying it! :eek: Boy, it makes you wonder what this stuff is Gil's recommending! ;) :lol:

    A.J.
  6. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Ajax,

    It's extremely difficult to do a "tag" with clear matte finish...., little wonder why they carded you.

    Best, Gil
  7. Ajax

    Ajax Member

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    ^ I guess it’s just my luck! :D

    I noticed that DN’s instructions recommend applying a coat of matte finish after building the model and that Scorpio also coated his Bismarck at the end of construction. Is this simply a difference of opinion as to the best time to apply the coat? Or would you recommend coating the completed model again after building it?

    A.J.
  8. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    A.J.

    It depends on a lot of conditions. I find it easier to just give the sheets a light spray at the beginning of the build to "fix" the surface art and allow misapplied water based glue smears to be easily cleaned from the surface without leaving evidence. I usually give the finished model another coat..., the matte finish also helps prevent the colors from fading over time.

    Best regards, Gil
  9. Ajax

    Ajax Member

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    Thanks, Gil. The warning on the can about multiple coats leading to a "frosted" appearance gave me pause, but I imagine it must take a number of repeated coats before that becomes an issue. I think I'll follow your method then and apply a coat to the model before and after.

    A.J.
  10. Texman

    Texman Guest

    Oddly enough, I found that my wife's hair spray set the colors, and
    left the card a matte finish. Actually looks more like real "flat" than
    printed on card stock. Any one else tried this? Its cheap, relatively
    clean, and you don't have to worry about the fumes as much.
  11. Renaud

    Renaud Member

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    Twelve years ago, I used spray varnish whose first purpose was car painting, I had from a dedicated store. I knew nothing about card modeling and these were basic airships models I found by chance in a shop selling at discount price books and others items, so I did not care a lot: my models were streaming with varnish, and I had even to remove some varnish with a sheet of paper, but eventually, the result was a mat aspect I was very satisfied with (I could expect gloss, as it was dedicated for cars!) and my models are still in perfect condition ( I could even clean them with water some years ago), not as these old photographs whose varnish and paper, having different characteristics, don't fit well each other regarding moisture, temperature, etc..; Be careful, I cannot make sure whether the colours were exactly the same after that, for I did not care about.
    I build one model every five years or so and it was the only time I used this method (I hanged my models onto the ceiling, and I wanted to clean them from dust from time to time), so try it first to check it one more time. It seems so odd tome that I am willing to do it again, to make sure...
  12. Renaud

    Renaud Member

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    Varnish (2)

    On my request about the possibility of making sea-worthy paper models ships, Wings of Horus sent me this http://www.waterproof-paper.com/
    Would it be suitable for models? As soon as I have a printer, I'll try it.

    P.S.:From time to time, I guess I am not a serious card modeller.
  13. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Hairspray used to be lacquer but has since been reformulated to use an acrylic lacquer much the same as the matte finish. Old fashioned lacquer works well to waterproof paper (does not mean water immersion) as does shellac. Lacquer doesn't affect the color as does shellac (the effect is minimal in most cases) and both stiffen the paper. I have some of the waterproof paper and haven't tried it yet. The literature of the URL from Horus speaks of "weatherproof" paper which is different from "waterproof". The only sure method of waterproofing paper is to coat it with a mixture of 50% activated polyurethane resin and 50% styrene monomer thinner. It will soak into the paper and when set yields a suprisingly strong composite (especially if reinforced with fiberglass). This was the subject of a post several site servers ago....,

    Best, Gil
  14. Renaud

    Renaud Member

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    1/One is weatherproof, the other is claimed to be waterproof indeed! I am eager to build an experimental basic ship and to leave it wandering in a bowl for a while, only to discover how long time it can resist. I am intended to be this way the Leonardo Da Vinci of the early XXIth century's card modelling.
    2/About resin to apply on card, I remember having read that some models shrink and distort so much in the summer, because of the weather ( excessive heating in USA southern states), until they come back to initial shape after, fortunately. Paper is a living stuff, don't you think it cannot be mixed with others, such as resin? I know that it is a problem architects have to deal with (for example wood and aluminium, in the summer, one shrinks when the other expands too much etc...) But is this a real problem with card modelling?
    Renaud
  15. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Renaud,

    Put a sample in water "before" you build..., expansion and contraction are not a problem with card models. A real problem is the absorbtion of water from the atmosphere can cause the paper to weaken and in time to become warped. Sealing "both" sides with acrylic matte spray will prevent this. I only used the polyester example as an extreme example. I know of several examples where Kraft paper was used in actual aircraft designs. It is cheap, strong, easily worked and highly available.

    Best regards, Gil
  16. Renaud

    Renaud Member

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    Old pre-Renaissance pictures were painted on wood. It always warped later on when no coat had been applied on the reverse side: paint needed to be applied on both sides to ensure the panel remained flat for ever. But, on the contrary, considering papermodels, how can you do it as the model is completed? You have no more access to the inner parts. Does the resin soaks so well and comes throught one side to another?
  17. Sticky Fingers

    Sticky Fingers Member

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    I mostly use spray gloss, satin or matte finishes such as those sold under the Krylon name in the US. On reason is I do my printing on a Minolta 2300 laser and want to avoid flaking of the bonded toner. The finishes will soak right through especially if you apply muliple coats. Even after a couple of weeks the sheets of card will have a slight odor from the finish. It is best to do this sort of thing in an area outside that will not be disturbed by the wind or dust. I tried this in the basement at home one day this winter and when the furnace kicked in the smell was intantly all through the house. She who must be obey was not happy :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

    http://www.krylon.com/main/product_...mp;productid=1736&content=product_details

    http://www.krylon.com/main/product_...mp;productid=1816&content=product_details
  18. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Renaud,

    A coat to protect and allow cleaning of finished models is the best you can do. Some models are subjected to moisture effects in houses where evaporative cooling is used to cool the air (popularly known in the U.S. as "swamp coolers"). These keep the humidity at very high levels for extended periods wherein the paper becomes saturated by the natural "wicking" action of the fiber. Coating the outside at least presents a moisture barrier to the water moisture preventing the paper from becomng "water logged". In short a light external coating is very effective in preventing damage from moisture effects.

    Best regards, Gil
  19. RyanShort1

    RyanShort1 Member

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    Any specific brand?

    Ryan

    I could get double use out of this... Use it for the models, and any leftovers could go into the potato cannon!
  20. Ajax

    Ajax Member

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