U-Don's U-Boot typ VII C

Discussion in 'Ship & Watercraft Models' started by Papa Mashy, Aug 1, 2018.

  1. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    Here we go.

    One U-boat with cloaking device. ;)

    I made the base out of a cereal box. I went for strength for this piece which has made the corner seams more obvious, but it's a base plinth after all and I'm not too fussed about that.
    I made the two cradles from standard thin card.
    (Not glued it all up yet. will wait until the sub hull is completed to ensure the stand fits properly.
    IMG_20180731_230158726.jpg
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2018
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  2. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    OK hive mind, I've cut all the pieces for hull skeleton/frame. I didn't realise how big this model is going to be!
    I've dry fit it all together and it all looks good. I am now wrestling with the best way to glue this together to ensure correct alignment and true given to flexibility of the material.
    I'm thinking flip the deck over, glue the centre spine (first half) then build the up the first 9 ribs adding the lateral piece to tie all together. I'm also thinking PVA to give me more time..
    All thoughts welcome. IMG_20180801_173602001.jpg
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  3. Rhaven Blaack

    Rhaven Blaack ADMINISTRATOR Administrator Moderator

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    You are off to a good start! I am looking forward to seeing how it will turn out.
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  4. Gandolf50

    Gandolf50 Researcher of obscure between war vehicles... Moderator

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    Can't quit tell how they fit.. but making an educated ( ah humm?) guess I would say you are on the best tact ..center spine.. forming the cross, then work with the formers, center out, glue all around the slots and none on the edges! But I would leave off the lateral piece till you flip and do the other side center spline and get it in place.. then do both laterals! " I think that makes sense at least, when I just built it in my head from you pix!"... and it should be nice and straight! Just like a rather LARGE aircraft fuselage!
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  5. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    My plan of flipping the deck and working in sections is going well so far.
    Only glueing the ribs to the top deck and the top slots intially allows nice square positioning. (I transferred the guide lines to ensure correct position)
    Once a section is complete, add the lateral ribs and then glue up the bottom half of the ribs taking out any warping.
    Progress so far.. IMG_20180803_071112108.jpg
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  6. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator Moderator

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    Work from the ends towards the center, as it is easier to fix center pieces than end ones. Also, to keep the Hull straight, make the ship symmetric, to keep the tension from wracking the hull. Looks like your off to a great start. I like the stand. Thanks. :)

    p.s. Here's a link for this model if anyone else is interested. :) http://udonfactory.the-ninja.jp/paper/down/Udown.html
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  7. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    IMG_20180806_130307552.jpg I said I wasn't fussed about the base plinth and went for strength over style...
    After having read further forum threads, I couldn't live with the finish of the base. After all, I'm here to learn and improve!

    The base pictured in the first post, (which was actually my second attempt!) I used the tabs as per the design. Obviously this left some large ugly seams.
    On to MK3 then.
    This time.. NO TABS and chamfering for a better joint fit.
    I'm much happier with the next version. The joins are much cleaner. There is no filler yet and all I have done is painted the cut ends. (pics below - Mk2 left - Mk3 right)
    To be honest I may still use some filler and then repaint the whole thing in a different colour. The join between the support posts and the base could also be tidied then too, although there isn't much to do there either, but it may quell any nagging thoughts.
    Anyway I think I am satisfied that Mk3 is a good enough build that I can revisit this later for final finishing. I've got a submarine to build after all!
    IMG_20180806_125708383.jpg IMG_20180806_130219690.jpg
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  8. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator Moderator

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    Wow!! That second base is superb!! :)
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  9. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    Thanks. It's down to the excellent advice and tips freely shared on this forum that spurred me on though. :)
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  10. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    The main internal structure is complete. It recommended 0.5 card... Didn't have any so used 210gsm. It was a bit on the thin side and I had to do some in fill here and there, but the structure is nice and straight.
    My plan of working upside down also worked well as it kept the deck nice and flat preventing twisting during the build.
    IMG_20180811_131836895.jpg IMG_20180811_132004986.jpg IMG_20180811_131909915.jpg
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  11. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    On to the hull plating then.
    Thinking further ahead beyond the basic construction I have been doing a bit of research to see whether to make this a model of one of the more renown boats of the war. Haven't decided yet but found some good resource websites:
    www.uboat.net
    www.uboataces.com

    I've also been experimenting with adding rivet detail. I might be making a bit of a rod for my back, but the added texture I think brings it more to life.
    I maybe some while build this!
    IMG_20180811_114910003.jpg
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  12. subnuke

    subnuke Moderator Intelligence Extraordinaire Moderator

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    I would caution against rivet detail. When I first read that I was wondering what rivets you were talking about. I served on submarines. Everything is welded. Then I thought maybe the Germans used rivets. Doing a search on the Type VII C shows many plastic models and most of them have rivets. But, there happens to be a beached Type VII. I found a closeup shot of the hull. No rivets. There are long welds and they do bead the welds.

    That can easily be modeled, but I would advise research first. Not all of the weld lines had beads and most were very small. It appears the part of the hull that under water while surfaced had an anti-fouling coating. They still do today. Most models picture this coating as red paint. That is not always true. My ship had that when it was newly built. When I saw my beloved submarine out of water in a floating drydock, her coating was an aqua shade of blue. It also wasn't paint but a coating. This coating would cover the very small weld lines to form a smooth hull. I mention this only because the picture I saw of the beached Type VII C had this blue coating and the hull was smooth.

    A lengthy response, I know, but I didn't just want to say don't do it, trust me. I learned to distrust the accuracy of anything associated with a plastic model a long time ago. I also don't trust drawings either. Photographs are the way to go. Compare as many as you can get. Germany especially had great variation between specific machines during WWII.

    But, in the end, it's your thing, do what you want to do, as the song goes.
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
  13. Gandolf50

    Gandolf50 Researcher of obscure between war vehicles... Moderator

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  14. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    Thanks subnuke and Gandolf.
    I had read that one of the real crew of U96 complained about a scene in Das Boot when rivets were giving way because the subs were welded.
    I did fall into the trap because I couldn't find decent close up period photos, I assumed that the existing display boat may have been restored and the rivet detail lost by preservation coatings.
    Stupid thought really. If I had applied more thought, rivets are a bad idea considering the pressures a sub experiences and and would be a major design flaw!
    Thanks for saving me considerable time. Although I have learnt another technique on my diversion.
    Thanks again for the prompt course correction.
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018
  15. subnuke

    subnuke Moderator Intelligence Extraordinaire Moderator

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    Upon further research, submarine hulls were riveted prior to WWII. BUT, they were only submersible boats and were only underwater to hide. They could not dive to deep depths for prolonged periods. In WWI they only needed to dive to periscope depth for very short periods of time. After 1920 the technology was developed and the weldable steel for the hull became available in 1940. So, if you build an older sub, rivets are correct, though they would be small and the seams tight. The riveted hulls use a membrane material to seal the riveted plates.

    Sorry to highjack your thread, sometimes I can't help myself.
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  16. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator Moderator

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    I'm happy someone else mentioned the bit about "Rivets". :)
  17. Papa Mashy

    Papa Mashy New Member

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    IMG_20180826_200026114.jpg IMG_20180826_200401992.jpg IMG_20180826_200131909.jpg Update of progress.

    The majority of the hull now done. Keel, rudder section, prop entry points and rubbing strips to go before laying down a primer coat.

    I 've been researching and have decided to make this a model of U552. There are plenty of historical photos to reference and is was a very successful boat sinking the first US navy ship (USS Reuben James).

    It looks a bit rough at the moment. I'm aiming to get this model as smooth as possible. The welding lines are not really descernable in photos as from what I've read and seen the weld lines are small and infilled.

    I'm still impressed with this model. It goes together well. There are slight adjustments here and there but that is more down to my ability than the design.
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  18. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator Moderator

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    That Hull is fantastic!!! :)
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  19. micahrogers

    micahrogers ...And the Wife...

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    looking really good, Z is the boat guy, I served on ships, but never paid that much attention to construction techniques.
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  20. THE DC

    THE DC Highly Esteemed Member

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    What a great thread!

    I have beeb tempted to try a WWII sub and your pics are step by step and your details clear, providing guidance toward someone else's build efforts.

    Slainte!
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