The old 32 to 40 foot wood reefer

Discussion in 'HO Scale Model Trains' started by toptrain1, Oct 3, 2008.

  1. toptrain1

    toptrain1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    562
    Likes Received:
    19
    reefer Land O' Smile's 107 9 16 06 004.jpg reefer b Robin Hood 5307 9 24 06 048.jpg reefer Cudahy 9250c 9 24 06 021.jpg reefer Brookside Dairy MTC 1883b 9 24 06 033.jpg reefer Asco Milk 12076b 8 15 06 024.jpg Here is a disrespected car. Once flashing brilliant collors. Adorned with remarkable eyecatching art work of many collors. They brought brightness and interest to the basic group of rail cars forming a train. Missing today from modern rails is this type of car. Trying to watch a train of three level car carriers go by is a boaring experiance as comparied to what was. The goverment in it's need to do whatever it did, and for reasons, to me at this time makes no sense at all. Ended a very interesting eara.
    Post photos here of you favorite reefers.
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  2. ZeldaTheSwordsman

    ZeldaTheSwordsman Thomas Modeler

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2008
    Messages:
    172
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, I think the metal reefers are insulated better, therefore keeping the load cold longer. But their looks would improve dramatically with these paint schemes.
  3. toptrain1

    toptrain1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    562
    Likes Received:
    19
    post 3
    reefer Clicquot Club NADX 1506 9 24 06 061.jpg reefer Jelke URTCo.10805 Goodluck Margine 9 24 06 050.jpg Zelda

    Zelda : You are very proficent in your analization of reefers. Now I think my approach to reefers was---different. I like the colors. I'm a model railroader. I realy don't care how cold they get, only how nice they look when I run them. I guess that is the little kid in me. Not very prototypical!
    frank
    PS I can't pass up another chance to put another picture in.Here's two more. Still in their boxs. Also one of the other photos was of s steel 40' reefer.
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  4. FiatFan

    FiatFan Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2004
    Messages:
    192
    Likes Received:
    0
    Here are all of mine, assembled earlier this summer for a family photo.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Tom
  5. MasonJar

    MasonJar It's not rocket surgery

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2002
    Messages:
    5,718
    Likes Received:
    0
    Billboard type reefers were banned before WW2 basically because it was felt that the shipper was subsidizing the advertiser. E.g. If you were ABC Meat Co., would you want your meat shipped in a reefer carrying the name of XYZ Meat Co.?

    Wood construction was replaced by steel as per "advancements" in most other types of rolling stock (e.g. box cars, wood sided gons, or composite hoppers), and eventually ice was replaced by mechanical refrigeration. Certainly there were improvements in insulation materials and methods as well, but the three advancements were not in lock-step.

    Andrew
  6. toptrain1

    toptrain1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    562
    Likes Received:
    19
    You make it sound like ABC didn't have the right to place their own advertisement on the cars they use. They did ! ABC could have leased their own cars with their name on them. They could buy their own cars! You can bet they paid less to ship in someone elses car. It's like telling someone they could not advertise on a billboard along a highway because it was outside a city where a competitor was located.
    frank
  7. armchair

    armchair New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 21, 2008
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    0
    Billboard reefers

    So now our governments sell "Naming Rights" to stadiums, event centers and even to events. Case in point: NFL Cardinals didn't like playing in a 'college' stadium :cry: so they had 'governments' build them a new stadium and the 'governments' then sold the naming rights to "University of Phoenix." I think that is sort of payback. wall1

    Armchair aka Glen sign1
  8. ed acosta

    ed acosta Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2005
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    0
    Billboard Reefers

    I am a proud owner of some unusual Train Minature billboard cars. I loved the paint and workmanship of their cars and its too bad they went out of production early on. Certainly the cars were not as tall as Athearn and Roundhouse cars, so they looked a bit undersized in comparison. I suspect that they are not exactly scaled down correctly. Maybe that brought about their demise.

    Min.JPG

    Min1.JPG

    Min2.JPG
  9. doctorwayne

    doctorwayne Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2005
    Messages:
    3,844
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ed, your Ball Line car is a boxcar, even though it's painted yellow. ;):-D Train Miniature cars are among my favourites and their height is correct for most of the cars depicted - most represent cars from the '20s, when many cars had inside heights of less than 9'.
    Here are a few of my favourite reefers:
    Train Miniature plugdoor -
    [​IMG]

    Tichy -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn all-steel -
    [​IMG]

    And another Athearn -
    [​IMG]

    And another Athearn -
    [​IMG]

    Modified Athearn (representing an overhead bunker car, with 8 hatches) -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn (wood sides, steel ends) -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn (wood sides and ends) -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn (modified version of the car above, with wood ends and no ice bunkers) -
    [​IMG]

    Red Caboose -
    [​IMG]

    Another Red Caboose -
    [​IMG]

    Train Miniature (all steel) -
    [​IMG]

    Tyco 36' Ice Service car -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn 50' express reefer -
    [​IMG]

    Train Miniature all wood reefer rebuilt as an express car -
    [​IMG]

    Walthers PRR all-steel express reefer -
    [​IMG]

    Athearn all-steel reefer -
    [​IMG]

    Intermountain -
    [​IMG]

    Intermountain -
    [​IMG]

    And, just for the heck of it, a yellow boxcar (Accurail) ;):-D -
    [​IMG]

    Wayne
  10. e-paw

    e-paw Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2007
    Messages:
    209
    Likes Received:
    0
    :thumb:I found an east bound out of Scranton full of them, with f-3's+an rs-1 on the point and dr441500's to help with the braking.:eek:

    Attached Files:

  11. ed acosta

    ed acosta Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2005
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    0
    Doctorwayne, thanks for sharing those very realistic photos. I love the light, but effective weathering jobs. One of these days I hope to gather enough courage to try a little weathering.

    I suppose I was a bit harsh on Train Miniatures. As I mentioned earlier, I prize my limited collection of Train Miniature cars. Certainly these older wooden reefers were shorter in comparison to later built reefers, but I do feel that the steel reefer and box cars which they produce were a bit too short. Perhaps you can visually judge the height of the following box cars and see for yourself. The trucks are standard HO scale sprung trucks which appear almost gargantuan underneath these cars.
    -Ed
    08Aug 029.JPG CNJ 21615.JPG
  12. doctorwayne

    doctorwayne Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2005
    Messages:
    3,844
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nice photos, e-paw. ;):thumb::thumb:

    Ed, I'm pretty sure that for the most part, the Train Miniature cars are correct. I'm not sure about the prototype for the first car that I posted, above, but I think that, for the most part, their cars are pretty good representations of their prototypes.
    Here's a TM X-29:
    [​IMG]

    And the car immediately behind it in the photo above is this X-29, by Red Caboose - you'll note that the cars are the same height:
    [​IMG]

    TM made a similar car, but with different ends and a revised side-sheet layout, to represent the ARA car...
    [​IMG]

    ...which can also be modified to represent a door-and-a-half car...
    [​IMG]

    ...or a doubledoor car...
    [​IMG]

    ...as can the X-29 be modified into a X-28 automobile car...
    [​IMG]

    This is another car type based on the low roof-line car - this one is currently being rebuilt with new ends and a modification to the structural steel framing:
    [​IMG]

    Here's another of the same type, but with the modified framing - it's also being rebuilt with new ends:
    [​IMG]

    Here's a similar car, complete with the new ends:
    [​IMG]

    I currently have 7 of these single sheathed cars being rebuilt, and another 10 of the X-29/ARA type undergoing upgrades.

    Wayne
  13. ed acosta

    ed acosta Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2005
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    0
    DoctorWayne,
    Thanks for the photos. I suppose there are a few Train Miniature cars that are not quite up to correct height. There is some justification: I recall the olden days of wooden box cars and recall that while watching a freight train go by, there were noticeable differences in height between cars. In later years the height of cars seems to have become more uniform. But there are marked height differences between some Train Miniature cars and those produced by other kit manufacturers. When running trains, I try not to mix those that are too short with those that are tall. Here is a comparison of T-M with an older Athearn box.
    -Ed

    BTW, I found this website for Train Miniature beer car collectors: http://www.hobeercars.com/manufacturers/tm.html

    080Oct 003.JPG
  14. Russ Bellinis

    Russ Bellinis Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2003
    Messages:
    4,707
    Likes Received:
    0
    Just for general info, what the ICC banned as far as bill boards were concerned was that the bill board had to advertise only what was carried in the car. The result was that the railroads no longer could put advertising on the cars because they used the reefers for all sorts of loads and for different customers. After the ban was put in place, the only bill board refers still operating were the meat packer's reefers because they were all privately owned.

    As far as lengths of the cars were concerned, the meat packers used 36 foot cars exclusively right up until they quit shipping by rail. Their warehouses and packing house loading docks were originally built to fit the door spacing of 36 foot cars, and they were not willing to rebuild facilities to fit bigger cars. The result was that even in the late 1950's or early 1960's when they were running all metal reefers, they were still 36 footers.
  15. wjstix

    wjstix Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2004
    Messages:
    218
    Likes Received:
    0
    It's amazing how this myth continues on that the railroads leased out advertising space on their cars. wall1 It basically comes from a misunderstanding of how cars were owned or leased.

    100+ years ago the cars were owned by the railroad, and leased to the company that wanted to use it. That's why you find pics of old cars with both the railroad's name and the company's name on it. The company is the lessee, they didn't just pay to put their ad on the side of the car. They were called Billboard reefers because they used big lettering on the side, like a billboard sign, not because they were paid advertisements like billboard signs.

    Later the government (I believe during Theodore Roosevelt's administration) ruled that the railroads had a monopoly re refrigerator cars, so the railroads set-up related but technically separate companies. Some were owned by several railroads, like Fruit Growers Express or Pacific Fruit Express, some worked with just one railroad like Burlington Refrigerator Express (CB&Q), Western Fruit Express (GN) etc.

    BTW leased cars can be spotted by their reporting marks which always end in "X". BREX doesn't mean Burlington Refrigerator EXpress, the BRE is the company name and the X indicates it's a leased car.

    Anyway, the problem the railroads got into is they would get a call to deliver a reefer to ABC packing co., and the first one they had iced up and ready to go was lettered for XYZ co. ABC packing would refuse to use the car, not wanting to pay to send a car across country as a rolling advertisement for their competitor. So, the RR would have to go get another car.

    The ICC ruling in the 1930's said lettering on cars not used in captive service could only be so large (IIRC something like 16" high letters?) and couldn't have big graphic etc., and that the cars then had to be accepted as interchange by any company...ABC packing couldn't refuse an XYZ co. car, or if they did, they had to reimburse the RR or some such deal.

    So I know some folks like to think about that evil "gubmint" restricting business and all that, but really the rule against billboard cars was more a case of government regulation helping an industry (the railroads). :mrgreen:
  16. shaygetz

    shaygetz Active Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2003
    Messages:
    3,877
    Likes Received:
    0
    Two of my favorite and oldest reefers, I hope sometime this winter to finish them and eleven others off this winter and run a string of them at local train shows. They are Strombecker paper and wood kits from the late 40s early 50s...and yes, I plan to use truck mounted Mantua hook/loops for the whole train:thumb:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
  17. nachoman

    nachoman Guest

    Armchair - Oh, I thought the university of phoenix was going to start up a football program! ;)

    Kevin
  18. nkp174

    nkp174 Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2006
    Messages:
    1,545
    Likes Received:
    0
    Not quite HO...and only the sides since I don't have a crisp picture of the assembled car...

    I have a hard time thinking of reefers without thinking of Tiffanys....especially the South Park's Tiffanys.
    [​IMG]

    There is a wonderful photo on page 276 of John H. White's American Railroad Freight Car...it shows an 8-wheeler pulling a string of Tiffany cars...every car is a slightly different color...which reflects nicely on the classic debate of what color the DSP&P cars were: white, straw yellow, or mint green.

    The Rio Grande also had a really interesting car I've seen one photo of...it isn't a reefer, possibly a ventilated boxcar, advertising that it is a fruit car. It looks like a J&S 26' Boxcar.
  19. toptrain1

    toptrain1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    562
    Likes Received:
    19
    5-11-08 trains 001.jpg post 19

    The Southern Pacific Overnight Merchandise Service

    On this old wood car the black and yellow lettered Winged SP stands out.
    Last edited: Jan 1, 2017
  20. toptrain1

    toptrain1 Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2007
    Messages:
    562
    Likes Received:
    19
    reefer IGA 16817a 9 24 06 010.jpg reefer IGA 16803 9 24 06 038.jpg The IGA, Independent Grocers Alliance

    Here are Train Miniatures 40' wood and steel IGA reefers. The Independent Grocers Alliance Reefers.
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2016