super elevation

Discussion in 'N / Z Scale Model Trains' started by belg, Mar 14, 2003.

  1. belg

    belg Member

    Apr 29, 2001
    Likes Received:
    I was reading on one of those other sites about this topic and wondering if there talking about the same thing as banking on a race track.GO #20 Also for some of us newbie's is there somewhere we can find what alot of the initials you guys use mean??
  2. billk

    billk Active Member

    Jun 13, 2001
    Likes Received:
    You guessed it - super-elevation = banked turns. Only not nearly as much as with NASCAR - we're talking about putting a sshim under the outer rail ere.
    in fact with the weight of model railroad rolling stock, etc., it probably adds nothing performance-wise (in fact, could easily hurt performance if you screw it up), and so is more for appearance only. I personally wouldn't mess with it.
  3. cidchase

    cidchase Active Member

    May 15, 2002
    Likes Received:
    Hi belg,
    here are a few non-mrr specific Web abbreviations:
    AFAIK- As far as I know...
    AFK- Away from keyboard
    ATM- At The Moment
    BFN- Bye For Now
    BBS- Bulletin Board Systems
    BRB- Be Right Back
    BTW- By The Way
    FAQ- Frequently Asked Questions
    FOFL- Falling On Floor Laughing
    FWIW- For What it's Worth
    FYI- For Your Information
    GAL- Get A Life
    GG- Gotta Go
    HAGD- Have a Great Day
    HAND- Have a Nice Day
    HTH- Hope This Helps
    IAE- In Any Event
    ICBW- I Could Be Wrong
    IIRC- If I Recall Correctly
    IMAO- In My Arrogant Opinion
    IMHO- In My Humble Opinion
    IMNSHO- In My Not So Humble Opinion
    IMO- In My Opinion
    IOW In Other Words
    IRL In Real Life
    ISDN It Still Does Nothing
    ISWYM I See What You Mean
    ISTR I Seem To Recall
    LMAO Laughing My A** Off
    LOL Laughing Out Loud
    OTOH On The Other Hand
    PMFJI Pardon Me For Jumping In
    ROFL Rolling on the Floor Laughing
    ROTFL Rolling On The Floor Laughing
    ROTFLMAO Rolling On the Floor, Laughing My A** Off
    RFC Request For Comment
    SFAIAA So Far As I Am Aware
    SFMP Sorry For Multiple Posts
    SCNR Sorry, Could Not Resist
    SITD Still In The Dark
    SO Significant Other
    SOHO Small Office Home Office
    TIA Thanks In Advance
    TIC Tongue In Cheek
    TTFN Ta ta For Now
    TTYL Talk To You Later
    TWIMC To Whom It May Concern
    TYVM Thank You Very Much
    WYSIWYG What You See Is What You Get

    Some are very common, some not.
    Maybe someone could get up a list of mrr abbreviations?:) :)
  4. sumpter250

    sumpter250 multiscale modelbuilder

    Jan 19, 2002
    Likes Received:
    By their very nature, model trains do not behave the same way as the prototype. Weight distribution, and friction in the wheel bearings, have a tendancy to cause model rolling stock to pull into a curve. In some cases, long trains, and tight curves, the train falls into the inside of a curve. If that curve is superelevated, the problem gets worse.
    In real practice, the outer rail of a curve is only slightly higher than the inside. If the actual difference is modeled, you almost don't see the result, so it has to be overdone to get the effect.
    Given the extra effort to include superelevation, and the problems it can cause, we can't run double stacks on the club layout because of the superelevated curves, I'd recommend not using superelevation on the layout.
    A curve, in a diorama, for photographic effect.......This makes more sense.
  5. 60103

    60103 Pooh Bah

    Mar 25, 2002
    Likes Received:
    To do superelevation (or cant ) properly, you have to use a transition curve, where the radius gradually gets tighter. That's because each radius + speed combination has its own degree of superelevation. If you go straight into an 18" curve, you should have a 1/4" step up in the outside rail. :D
    The speed part is important. Our commuter train often stopped on one curve and you could feel yourself sliding across the seat. Brit mags often talk about "cant deficiency", which is how much less tilt you get than perfectly unnoticeable.
  6. Clerk

    Clerk Active Member

    Nov 6, 2002
    Likes Received:
    My curves have a slight elevation on the outside and it look so realastic when my trains go around the curves. I have no trouble with derailments. My long trains I make sure the heavy cars are toward the front of the train.
  7. cidchase

    cidchase Active Member

    May 15, 2002
    Likes Received:
    I did not super-elevate and it was a mistake. It just does not look right once you're aware of it. :eek: Most is not ballasted yet and I'll prolly be going back under that track, but not really lookin' forward to it :D :D :D
  8. grumbeast

    grumbeast Member

    Jan 13, 2003
    Likes Received:
    I tried super-elevation on a fairly tight 12" radius
    loopback I relaid. I used a decent easement and then simply
    used shirt cardboard shims along the outside edge of the
    cork roadbed. So far I've not had a single derailment on
    the curve and although the effect is subtle, it does look
    great, So I'd personally recommend it just be careful
    when laying the curve :) :)

  9. WAnt track that's looking great, super-elevate!

    I have also used thin index card shims under the outside ties before ballasting, with a gradual transition on easement curves down to 16" without problems, including long stack trains of Walthers 5-car units. Alas, I have sold those tall beasts and now model transition period, but the Super Chief looks awfully good rolling into a curve at speed.

    My typical trains are no more than 30 cars in length...much longer trains may cause trouble, especially if all the cars are not properly weighted. Try it out, and test it thoroughly before ballasting the track. For me, it really adds to the pleasure of watching my trains.

    The photo below shows the effect a little bit, looks better in live motion.

  10. Lighthorseman

    Lighthorseman Active Member

    Jul 24, 2002
    Likes Received:

    OutSTANDING, Verne!:) :)