rotary engines

Discussion in 'Gallery & Designs' started by Richard, Apr 26, 2006.

  1. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Rotary Sayonara...,

    Hi Bengt,

    The large amount of rotating mass represented by the propellor, cylinders and crankcase gave the rotary a large torque. The effect on pilotage was such that a rotary equipped aircraft had a snap turn in one direction (opposite direction of the prop rotation) and a very moderated turning ability in the other. Flying them was not an easy task and from the realistic simulators I've tried I am left wondering how they flew them at all let alone dog fight in them...,

    -Gil
  2. Gil

    Gil Active Member

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    Rotary Sayonara...,

    Hi Bengt,

    The large amount of rotating mass represented by the propellor, cylinders and crankcase gave the rotary a large torque. The effect on pilotage was such that a rotary equipped aircraft had a snap turn in one direction (opposite direction of the prop rotation) and a very moderated turning ability in the other. Flying them was not an easy task and from the realistic simulators I've tried I am left wondering how they flew them at all let alone dog fight in them...,

    -Gil
  3. Ashrunner

    Ashrunner Member

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    Bengt

    Yes...this has been an educational thread.

    I had known the basic operation of the rotary engine. One of the things about that type of engine was the loss of efficiency when spinning such large masses.

    As I look at early aviation and aircraft design, it was an obvious progression from the flat, in-line design of the original Wright engine using a pulley style system to spin to props, to wanting to avoid the pulleys and putting the engine with the prop. The fragility of the airframes then would require less vibration and the rotary engine was more or less an invention of necessity.

    Definitely interesting that Fokker was able to get horsepower out of an engine design based on a similar Gnome engine. But then, Anthony Fokker was an interesting person.

    Ashrunner
  4. Ashrunner

    Ashrunner Member

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    Bengt

    Yes...this has been an educational thread.

    I had known the basic operation of the rotary engine. One of the things about that type of engine was the loss of efficiency when spinning such large masses.

    As I look at early aviation and aircraft design, it was an obvious progression from the flat, in-line design of the original Wright engine using a pulley style system to spin to props, to wanting to avoid the pulleys and putting the engine with the prop. The fragility of the airframes then would require less vibration and the rotary engine was more or less an invention of necessity.

    Definitely interesting that Fokker was able to get horsepower out of an engine design based on a similar Gnome engine. But then, Anthony Fokker was an interesting person.

    Ashrunner
  5. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    GreMir's Me329 kit has some niceley detailed DB 603 engines, might be worth the price of the model just for getting those engines..

    Attached Files:

  6. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    GreMir's Me329 kit has some niceley detailed DB 603 engines, might be worth the price of the model just for getting those engines..
  7. Jim Krauzlis

    Jim Krauzlis Active Member

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    Indeed, 46rob!

    I have a few of Gemir's models, just waiting for time to start them up, but they are quite detailed and quite impressive designs; well worth a look.

    Wonderful thread, Richard! Quite an education and lots of excellent build photos to please the eye!
    Great job!!

    Cheers!
    Jim
  8. Jim Krauzlis

    Jim Krauzlis Active Member

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    Indeed, 46rob!

    I have a few of Gemir's models, just waiting for time to start them up, but they are quite detailed and quite impressive designs; well worth a look.

    Wonderful thread, Richard! Quite an education and lots of excellent build photos to please the eye!
    Great job!!

    Cheers!
    Jim
  9. Bengt F

    Bengt F Active Member

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    GreMir Messerschmitt Me.329 Engine And Le Rhône 110 hp Rotary Engine

    Very nice work, Rob,

    That Daimler-Benz 12-cylinder engine has certainly got a lot of detail - it seems like a demanding (and rewarding) build!

    Re. card model rotary engines (other than Richard´s fine models):
    I just downloaded a Fokker V4 prototype PDF card model from Roman Seißler at Sero-Paperwarbirds (Morewings in this forum!).
    This model has got a detailed 110 hp Le Rhône rotary engine in 1:33 scale, complete with exhaust pipes.
    Here´s a low-res sample (a small portion) of this engine model:

    [​IMG]

    All of Roman´s models displays this fine accuracy and refinement of contour lines.

    Bengt :smile:
  10. Bengt F

    Bengt F Active Member

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    GreMir Messerschmitt Me.329 Engine And Le Rhône 110 hp Rotary Engine

    Very nice work, Rob,

    That Daimler-Benz 12-cylinder engine has certainly got a lot of detail - it seems like a demanding (and rewarding) build!

    Re. card model rotary engines (other than Richard´s fine models):
    I just downloaded a Fokker V4 prototype PDF card model from Roman Seißler at Sero-Paperwarbirds (Morewings in this forum!).
    This model has got a detailed 110 hp Le Rhône rotary engine in 1:33 scale, complete with exhaust pipes.
    Here´s a low-res sample (a small portion) of this engine model:

    [​IMG]

    All of Roman´s models displays this fine accuracy and refinement of contour lines.

    Bengt :smile:
  11. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    Bengt--actually--that's not my build, but one of the pictures GreMir's put into the kit. I haven't got that far on my (somewhat less than perfect) build. Just thought I'd show you what you're missing.
  12. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    Bengt--actually--that's not my build, but one of the pictures GreMir's put into the kit. I haven't got that far on my (somewhat less than perfect) build. Just thought I'd show you what you're missing.
  13. mikew

    mikew Member

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    Large inline engines, such as used in WWII fighter and bomber aircraft, were just about always liquid cooled- offhand, I don't recall any that were air cooled. Military aircraft don't use piston engines all that much any more, but I'm pretty sure you'll find any of them in the 1000 hp range or higher have liquid cooling.

    Mike
  14. mikew

    mikew Member

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    Large inline engines, such as used in WWII fighter and bomber aircraft, were just about always liquid cooled- offhand, I don't recall any that were air cooled. Military aircraft don't use piston engines all that much any more, but I'm pretty sure you'll find any of them in the 1000 hp range or higher have liquid cooling.

    Mike
  15. Jim Krauzlis

    Jim Krauzlis Active Member

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    Again, I second those comments, Bengt!

    Roman is one of those very talented artists we are blessed to have in paper modeling, and it shows in each of his offerings. I have two of his Dr1 models, each one a wonderful job with superb graphic renderings. I actually started one before work and family took it's toll on my free time the last few weeks...actually about a month and a half, now.:cry:

    Glad you mentioned his work, Bengt; he has designed a very nice, detailed engine as part of his kits.

    Cheers!
    Jim
  16. Jim Krauzlis

    Jim Krauzlis Active Member

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    Again, I second those comments, Bengt!

    Roman is one of those very talented artists we are blessed to have in paper modeling, and it shows in each of his offerings. I have two of his Dr1 models, each one a wonderful job with superb graphic renderings. I actually started one before work and family took it's toll on my free time the last few weeks...actually about a month and a half, now.:cry:

    Glad you mentioned his work, Bengt; he has designed a very nice, detailed engine as part of his kits.

    Cheers!
    Jim
  17. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    Mikew--some early inline engines were aircooled--but not the later ones...I only used the WW2 examples as most folks recoognize the types. Here is a Kemp engine, made in the US prior to WW 1 and used in various period aircraft. It obviously doesn't fall into the same class as later Allisons, or even Liberty and OX-5 engines--but at the time when the rorary was in it's heyday--there were lots of other variations around.

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    • Kemp.jpg
      Kemp.jpg
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  18. 46rob

    46rob Member

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    Mikew--some early inline engines were aircooled--but not the later ones...I only used the WW2 examples as most folks recoognize the types. Here is a Kemp engine, made in the US prior to WW 1 and used in various period aircraft. It obviously doesn't fall into the same class as later Allisons, or even Liberty and OX-5 engines--but at the time when the rorary was in it's heyday--there were lots of other variations around.
  19. jyduchene

    jyduchene Member

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    Thanks Bengt, The animated graphic explains much. I had always wondered the mechanizm of the piston, shaft and crank. So am I correct in understanding that the length of the stroke is determined by the angle or degree of swing the piston arm can take? Also, how does the master cylinder obtain its stroke, i could not see in the diagram any movement of the piston arm of the master cylinder. My last question has to do with the mechanism of piston movement of the radial engine. Can some one point the way. I have always struggled with trying to imagine the crank shaft to allow 5, 7 or 9 pistons to move through the cycle. Thanks for a fasinating read. John
  20. jyduchene

    jyduchene Member

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    Thanks Bengt, The animated graphic explains much. I had always wondered the mechanizm of the piston, shaft and crank. So am I correct in understanding that the length of the stroke is determined by the angle or degree of swing the piston arm can take? Also, how does the master cylinder obtain its stroke, i could not see in the diagram any movement of the piston arm of the master cylinder. My last question has to do with the mechanism of piston movement of the radial engine. Can some one point the way. I have always struggled with trying to imagine the crank shaft to allow 5, 7 or 9 pistons to move through the cycle. Thanks for a fasinating read. John