Philippine Railways (PNR) Derailment :(

Discussion in 'The Real Thing- International' started by jon-monon, Nov 12, 2004.

  1. PNR5008

    PNR5008 New Member

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    Why thank you kind sir.
    I had mean't to join up in the past but had forgotten. Then I found you all again while doing searches for info on the PNR accident.

    Cheers
    Brad
  2. faroukstan

    faroukstan Member

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    Hi there Brad ! From one PNR-Loving guy to another Welcome and nice to hear you over here also (from Philippine Railways). Sure, something has to be done to ease the much conjested Philippine highways (?)..!

    MhmmdFAROUK
  3. Chessie6459

    Chessie6459 Gauge Oldtimer

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    Your quite welcome. Glad you were able to find the gauge again. This is the place to come to if you have a question, show off pictures from railfanning, of your layout, and just to talk. Always Glad to have another person Aboard The-Gauge. Have A Safe & Wonderful Week :wave:
  4. jon-monon

    jon-monon Active Member

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    Welcome to the-gauge, Brad!

    I'm PK Lumber Co on your list, in case you didn't recognize my voice ;)

    So, now we got three or four PNR fans on board! We're gunna have to do some PI modeling now!
  5. Chessie6459

    Chessie6459 Gauge Oldtimer

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    Jon, hear anything else about what is going to happen? Just curious.
  6. jon-monon

    jon-monon Active Member

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    I havn't Matthew, but I've been checking the news a lot less this week because I've been reassigned at work and can't play as much :(
  7. Chessie6459

    Chessie6459 Gauge Oldtimer

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    Oh Ok, I understand.
  8. faroukstan

    faroukstan Member

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    LiveSteamer - came upon your query on PNR derailment. There's nothing that had not been aired/printed already. But, here's an nupdate discussion by Philippine daily INQUIRER.....It's the missing SPIKES (not rails) that caused the derailment...please, read on.

    Jon, ho do you suggest we go about "PI Modeling"? It must be interesting for those "PNR-Lovers"....


    Missing railroad spikes caused Quezon train crash--DoTC

    Updated 04:27pm (Mla time) Nov 24, 2004
    By Joel Francis Guinto
    INQ7.net, Agence France-Presse




    Get INQ7 breaking news on your Smart mobile phone in the Philippines. Send INQ7 BREAKING to 386.


    THE THEFT of railroad spikes was the likely cause of a train crash in October in Quezon province that left at least seven people dead and more than 100 injured, the government said Wednesday.

    Transportation Secretary Leandro Mendoza said in a statement that an initial investigation of the November 12 accident showed that the Manila-bound train went off the tracks due to a "shifting" rail as the train negotiated a curve.

    Investigations showed that the spikes, which were supposed to have been holding down the railway tracks, were missing, Mendoza said.

    "Based on observation, the color and texture of the holes left by the spikes showed that they had long been missing and could not, therefore, be a part of a deliberate act to derail a passing train," he said.

    “Hence, the committee, even at this early stage, has ruled out sabotage or terrorist action as possible cause of the accident,” he added.

    "The rails themselves may not show any signs of damage but the rest of [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    the railway track components, especially the wooden ties and metal spikes need replacement or rehabilitation due to ageing, damage or pilferage," Mendoza said, quoting the report of the investigating body.

    He added that the trains were suffering from many defects such as defective gauges, including speedometers, defective airbags, and inoperative emergency brakes.

    The committee also recommended a “thorough survey” of the entire PNR system to prevent another tragedy, Mendoza said.

    Train driver Aurelio Leano tested negative for drug use, he added.

    The investigation further revealed that the train was traveling at 27.05 kilometers per hour, above the 25-kph speed limit, said Mendoza.

    Four of the five passenger coaches of the Philippine National Railways train with more than 300 people on board, came off the rails at speed near Padre Burgos town, 130 kilometers (81 miles) southeast of the capital.

    Railway officials have complained that the theft of railroad tracks, rail spikes, and other railway equipment by people, who sell them for scrap, might lead to accidents.








    Related Stories:
    [​IMG] The grand deception (Nov 21, 2004)
    [​IMG] Remembering the trains of our youth (Nov 21, 2004)
    [​IMG] Can the PNR get back on track? (Nov 21, 2004)




    And, here a reminiscent of how PNR was or has been. I was able to catch her at her prime and elegance in mid 50's and early 60's


    Remembering the trains of our youth

    Updated 08:02am (Mla time) Nov 21, 2004
    By Manuel and Patria Lorenzo, Retired government employees, Albay District, Legazpi City
    Inquirer News Service



    Editor's Note: Published on page A16 of the November 21, 2004 issue of the Philippine Daily Inquirer


    THE RECENT derailment of several Philippine National Railways coaches bound for Manila brings to mind a time when the trains evoked happy thoughts instead of sadness and exasperation. It is in Legazpi City where the famous Bicol Express begins and ends its daily run.

    There was a time of greatness for the railroad, especially for us who lived in what is usually called the pre-war years. True, we were very young then, first year secondary school students when Pearl Harbor was bombed, but the pleasant memories of the trains of our youth remain with us.

    Air of gentility

    We readily recall the impression that the trains and the passengers gave us, including those of us in the third-class coaches: there was an air of quiet gentility, of people who were kind to and considerate of each other.

    Every number of years, the PNR had the Rolling Exposition, something like a trade fair on wheels, during which several coaches filled with products and handicrafts from the [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    [​IMG]
    various regions of the country stayed for several days to exhibit and sell the goods on board. However, we the children and teenagers, were more interested in the food items for sale, especially the ice cream.

    Damage to psyche

    A big change was apparent right after the war. It seemed that the damage was done not just to the facilities but more so to the people's psyche.

    Survival, which was the most important thing during the war, transmuted into many undesirable forms. The gentility and quiet atmosphere of the pre-war years appeared to be lost, maybe not just on the trains but also in many other areas of community life.

    But there was a great improvement in the PNR when it was time for us to take our college studies in Manila. The most remembered periods were the stints of Salvador Villa and Nicanor Jimenez as general managers of the PNR. The trains were on schedule, the coaches were clean, and employees were honest.

    Uniformed conductors checked our tickets, and similarly garbed inspectors checked the number of passengers in the seats. Somebody, who wanted to get a free ride to Manila by hiding in the toilet every time the inspector entered the coach, was promptly caught and made to pay a fat fine.

    Adobo, ice cream

    The addition of a dining car to the passenger coaches became a source of much delight, especially for us who had to carefully save our pesos before our train trips so we could take at least one meal in the coach where our favorite chicken adobo and ice cream were available.

    On hindsight, maybe it was not so much the food as the feeling that we were in a first class hotel that gave us that excitement of going to the dining car. The waiters were in snappy-looking uniforms and were very polite. That was a thrill for us, the youth of the war that had just ended.

    When the night trips of the train became a regular feature of the Bicol Express, many of the young professionals took weekend trips to Manila for shopping, a movie or two, and Ma Mon Luk meriendas in Quiapo. By Monday morning, they would be back in Legazpi.

    After the birth of our youngest child in July 1966 at the Manila Doctors Hospital, we brought her home in a "sleeper coach," the newest feature of the night express train.

    It had four sleeping berths, double-deck on two sides, with enough space in between for getting in and out of the compartment. It was a smooth and pleasant ride for my mother-in-law, my husband, our baby girl, and me.

    Means for progress

    We realize now that the trains of those years were more than just a means of transporting people and goods. They were the passage to more productive lives, the means for progress of our region, which even now reels once again in the aftermath of a destructive typhoon.

    Will the PNR become a means for a better life for Bicol again? We hope and pray for this to happen in our lifetime, if possible.

    (Manuel Lorenzo, a medical doctor, was health officer of Legazpi City [1963-1983] and regional health director of Bicol [1986- 1993]. Patria Lorenzo is the first woman president of Bicol University [1988-1992].)









    Related Stories:
    [​IMG] Missing railroad spikes caused Quezon train crash--DoTC (Nov 24, 2004)
    [​IMG] The grand deception (Nov 21, 2004)
    [​IMG] Can the PNR get back on track? (Nov 21, 2004)


    Best to all

    MhmdFAROUK
  9. PNR5008

    PNR5008 New Member

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    HowDee,
    If only we could get another 500 or so modellers we could start some RTR kits :)
    As soon as life settles down I have two plans:

    1) Start a diorama of lineside shanties. Took a few photos and videos for ideas.
    2) Grab some of those HO jeep models and try using them to build some Jeepneys.

    What I really need is someone who can paint those Brazil build models for me :) Any proffesional model painters here? :)

    Cheers
    Brad
  10. PNR5008

    PNR5008 New Member

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    Not a Philippine related subject but can someone tell me how to put photos up on the group please?

    Thanks
    Brad
  11. faroukstan

    faroukstan Member

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    It's a nice a idea that of coming up with RTR/KITTED PNR models. But, I doubt on the attainable of the 500 number. NMRA memberlist have only two Filipinos registered. On top of that, I don't see any of the 3, or 4, Manila hobby shops carry railroad items. On this one can gage the condition of railroad modeling P.I. (rightfully, RP) style. But, then who knows???

    Brad, I looked forwad to seeing your diorama themed "HOME ALONG DA RILES"! Been entertaining the idea for sometime myself. But, don't have time to really embark on it. Any place where we can see that HO jeep? Besides the jeeps (or jeepneys) the motor Tri-cycles (gaudy painted as well) are worthy candidates for RP modeling accessories...

    Brad, are we taliking about this model, Frateschi ? This is unpainted depiction of a G.E.U20-C. This need a dress-up in PNR livery.

    Nice to hear from you on PNR....Keep it coming....

    MhmdFAROUK (Bicutan PNR Station)

    Attached Files:

  12. jon-monon

    jon-monon Active Member

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    Dear Farouk, I think for me I shall start with a nipa hut :) I think a Filipino pike of any vintage will be 90% scratch built and 10% bashed (which is what we call commercial parts that we modify).

    Kuya Brad, this should explain it all:

    http://the-gauge.com/showthread.php?t=9568

    If not, please ask again :)
  13. jon-monon

    jon-monon Active Member

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    BTW: Kuya Farouk I love the U boat! Have you decided about the paint yet? Myself, I love freelance roadnames, but in the case of PNR, I love PNR! So I can not offer any help deciding :)

    On the jeep I will send you this if you like:

    http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/625-672

    It's not quite like the modern Jeepney, being a WW2 Jeep, the hood is 4" lower. The modern Jeepney is modeled after a CJ-3B. I used to own one:

    http://www.film.queensu.ca/CJ3B/PaulsenSnow.html

    Did you decide what kadee couplers might fit the U boat?
  14. faroukstan

    faroukstan Member

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    Jon :

    First things first! I'm deeply moved and most honored with you addressing me "KUYA" (in Tausug it's KAKAH). I'll talk to your more on this on other venue....

    Nipa hut? Yes, it could be! I entertained doing a scenery that used to exist (until end of the the 50's) that is occupied now by the South Luzon Expressway and up to Alabang Tollway (some 10kms laway). It used to be strips of ricefields or rice paddies and dotted by Nipa houses at either side. One was assured every trip of seeing rice farmers tilling their plots with wooden harrow and carabao (domestic waterbuffalo) and those makeshift scarecrows and the farmers' NIPA huts. Have you any suggestion how to represent (model) NIPA fronds as roof-thatch? The nipa tree and the coconut palm tree looked alike but the fronds kind of different!Many moons ago, I experimented using the bristles of what is known as "Walis Tambo", that rice stalks-looking brooms (know that in 'Pinas!) to represent nipa thatch but haven't yet come closer to it. Needs adjustment or neew approach, I guess(?)! I met difficulty also in modeling coconut tree fronds. Tried it with chicken feather. It turned out somewhat overscale for HO.

    I have not decided yet on what livery the models be dressed-up. But, Im may go for the U20 as 918. There's a picture of it appearing in red ( I saw it somewhere). Yes, you mentioned the coupler. I have some Kadee No. 5 on stock. Do you think I can use this? The model comes with its coupler attached to the trucks.

    I can only agree PI/RP railroad modeling is mostly scratchbuilding,if not whole,effort. It took me two years of searching before finding models of G.E. U20 and U5(6,7,8,9,10,etc) by Frateschi of Brazil. And, still out of gauge being standard(American-British) gage and not Cape Gage (3' 6"). I think the only way to stay faithful to scale is to use TT (1:120) scale trackage and trucks. I remember coming across a SouthAfrican model railroad site discussing this method. Can't find that website now.

    A great JEEP (Filipinos call it "owner") you got there! At first glance it's a curiosity: the registration plate codes are made up of 3 alphabets and 3 numerals: CFY 228, Phililippines style (our Toyota FX Tamaraw carries UDD 510). Close inspection of the images the word PILIPINAS can be discerned at lower portion of the plate. It's a Philippine Vehicle Registration Plate! Are you allowed to use it there the way most stateside Pinoys do in Philippines vice versa?!!....After our VolksWagen (1976-1986) we exchange with WILLYS MB from a Jesuit priest until we got our lst FX in 96. I can say WILLYS was a very good vehicle. Easy on the pocket, maintenance wise. It can take any brand of spare parts! Perhaps it was meant to be that way because it's a war implement. It used to have still the rifle ( US M1-Garand) holder by the dash board, spade and the axe at the driver side fender(?) ... my brother-in-law has it and still it is running, powered by a Toyota 4K engine, instead of the original 2.20 c.c. in-line engine. I'll get you a snapshot when I get home on January 2k5.....

    Jon, the first jeepneys that plied Philippine streets ( 1946 to late 50's) were direct modification of the military type, Willys MB. It seated, at the back, 4 each side facing each other and two at the front, plus the driver. Philippine registration code was PUP (Public Utility Passenger). These jeeps were products of many enterprising individual "lateros" (tinsmiths -?) and mechanics
    whose talents were expressed on bountiful American war surplus jeeps. These times jeeps (jeepneys) were mostly bland, undecorated. The jeepney you came to be familiar with nowadays came about sometimes at the beginning of the 60's from the stables of SARAO, DAVID MOTORS, FRANSCISCO MOTORS. These are ,what you may call in modeling lingo, a complete "scratch-built" model as compared to the earlier one that were "kit-bashed"(!). From this time onward, the seating capacity kept on increasing from 6 each sides to the present 12-14 each sides. Also, the vehicle was found to be started garishly and gaudily decorated (thanks to those sidewalk sign painters/artists)as well as equipped with sound systems (stereo)! The registration started to change to PUJ (Public Utility Jeepney).

    well, I hope I'm not out of line here writing something about another mode of conveyance....Best regards.....

    MhmdFAROUK
  15. PNR5008

    PNR5008 New Member

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    Afternoon everyone,

    <<<It's a nice a idea that of coming up with RTR/KITTED PNR models. But, I doubt on the attainable of the 500 number.>>

    I guess you are probably correct on this.

    <<<On top of that, I don't see any of the 3, or 4, Manila hobby shops carry railroad items. On this one can gage the condition of railroad modeling P.I. (rightfully, RP) style. But, then who knows???>>>

    When I first went to the PI my wife said that I wont find anyone there who is remotely interested in railways. However on the second last day I purchased a copy of "Model Railroader" which to me suggested that perhaps there is a chance.
    Didnt take me long to find people both interested in the prototype and also the idea of modelling. I even surprised her by pointing out that some actually live over there.
    I went into the hobby shop at Shangri La on my latest trip. Had quite a bit of rail stuff but sadly not specialised enough to promote modelling the Philippines.

    <<<Brad, I looked forwad to seeing your diorama themed "HOME ALONG DA RILES"!>>>

    Me to. Twill be complete with a little Aussie railfan standing at the end of the station platform waiting for U Boats :)

    <<<Been entertaining the idea for sometime myself. But, don't have time to really embark on it.>>>

    Time and $$$$ is my big problem to at the moment.
    We rent a railway signalbox in Sydney and I spend a lot of the time there, though most of this is related to writing for Aussie and American rail mags more so than for modelling.
    We are planning to restart the layout downstairs however I doubt they will let me make a shantytown as part of it :(

    <<<Any place where we can see that HO jeep? Besides the jeeps (or jeepneys) the motor Tri-cycles (gaudy painted as well) are worthy candidates for RP modeling accessories...>>>

    Twas interesting to see the Walthers one but it looks like they may not have them available now, unless I am reading that wording a little wrong.I think something could be done with that.
    Someone on the PhilippineRailway Yahoogroup mentioned another outlet in the USA and gave a URL. I have been meaning to look back through the posts for this.
    Was it "Train and Trooper" or am I thinking of another shop?

    <<<Brad, are we taliking about this model, Frateschi ? This is unpainted depiction of a G.E.U20-C. This need a dress-up in PNR livery.>>>

    Yep thats the ones.
    The Baby-Boat really needs some severe front modifications but nothing to drastic. I think the U20 would look the part just painted up.
    I think the aim would be to get the feeling of our Philippines. Despite not being 100% right and of course not on narrow gauge (although that would not be impossible) a good bit of scenic detailing would really give a great layout.
    The red or blue liveries couldn't be that hard except for the PNR logo whcih would need someone with the ability to make decals.Even the older liveries were pretty much to a similar design.
    For a reasonably small system (especially now) they have had a vast amount of different liveries. I prefered the red livery over the current blue but sadly it is only worn by a handful of locos now.

    <<<Nice to hear from you on PNR....Keep it coming....>>

    Shall do. PNR is a favoured topic :)

    Anyway it is Saturday night and I am off to the signalbox. Have to answer the other posts later.

    Take care
    Brad
  16. PNR5008

    PNR5008 New Member

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    Afternoon everyone,

    <<<It's a nice a idea that of coming up with RTR/KITTED PNR models. But, I doubt on the attainable of the 500 number.>>

    I guess you are probably correct on this.

    <<<On top of that, I don't see any of the 3, or 4, Manila hobby shops carry railroad items. On this one can gage the condition of railroad modeling P.I. (rightfully, RP) style. But, then who knows???>>>

    When I first went to the PI my wife said that I wont find anyone there who is remotely interested in railways. However on the second last day I purchased a copy of "Model Railroader" which to me suggested that perhaps there is a chance.
    Didnt take me long to find people both interested in the prototype and also the idea of modelling. I even surprised her by pointing out that some actually live over there.
    I went into the hobby shop at Shangri La on my latest trip. Had quite a bit of rail stuff but sadly not specialised enough to promote modelling the Philippines.

    <<<Brad, I looked forwad to seeing your diorama themed "HOME ALONG DA RILES"!>>>

    Me to. Twill be complete with a little Aussie railfan standing at the end of the station platform waiting for U Boats :)

    <<<Been entertaining the idea for sometime myself. But, don't have time to really embark on it.>>>

    Time and $$$$ is my big problem to at the moment.
    We rent a railway signalbox in Sydney and I spend a lot of the time there, though most of this is related to writing for Aussie and American rail mags more so than for modelling.
    We are planning to restart the layout downstairs however I doubt they will let me make a shantytown as part of it :(

    <<<Any place where we can see that HO jeep? Besides the jeeps (or jeepneys) the motor Tri-cycles (gaudy painted as well) are worthy candidates for RP modeling accessories...>>>

    Twas interesting to see the Walthers one but it looks like they may not have them available now, unless I am reading that wording a little wrong.I think something could be done with that.
    Someone on the PhilippineRailway Yahoogroup mentioned another outlet in the USA and gave a URL. I have been meaning to look back through the posts for this.
    Was it "Train and Trooper" or am I thinking of another shop?

    <<<Brad, are we taliking about this model, Frateschi ? This is unpainted depiction of a G.E.U20-C. This need a dress-up in PNR livery.>>>

    Yep thats the ones.
    The Baby-Boat really needs some severe front modifications but nothing to drastic. I think the U20 would look the part just painted up.
    I think the aim would be to get the feeling of our Philippines. Despite not being 100% right and of course not on narrow gauge (although that would not be impossible) a good bit of scenic detailing would really give a great layout.
    The red or blue liveries couldn't be that hard except for the PNR logo whcih would need someone with the ability to make decals.Even the older liveries were pretty much to a similar design.
    For a reasonably small system (especially now) they have had a vast amount of different liveries. I prefered the red livery over the current blue but sadly it is only worn by a handful of locos now.

    <<<Nice to hear from you on PNR....Keep it coming....>>

    Shall do. PNR is a favoured topic :)

    Anyway it is Saturday night and I am off to the signalbox. Have to answer the other posts later.

    Take care
    Brad

    Below (if all goes well) is a piccie of another favourite topic :)

    Attached Files:

  17. Chessie6459

    Chessie6459 Gauge Oldtimer

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    Thanks Brad for the information :wave: