M48A3 Patton Tank Design

Discussion in 'Gallery & Designs' started by John Griffin, Apr 17, 2007.

  1. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    building a better track

    Will do. One thing I try to do is design a model that I would also enjoy assembling. So if I can get imagery to do as good a job as geometry, great. And if adding something just for the sake of showing off will give me a model I would hate to build, then I know I've gone too far with the nitpicky pieces.
    I'm certain that my tracks will still have many parts, but perhaps only 4-6 different types, repeated. I am trying to create a track that can be built assembly line style... alot of parts positioned on a page end-to-end so that they just need to be 'snipped off' instead of needing lots of exacto blade work for each one. In 1:16 scale it might not look as good as I hope, however but I think it's better to try it more modular first before going overkill.
  2. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    building a better track

    Will do. One thing I try to do is design a model that I would also enjoy assembling. So if I can get imagery to do as good a job as geometry, great. And if adding something just for the sake of showing off will give me a model I would hate to build, then I know I've gone too far with the nitpicky pieces.
    I'm certain that my tracks will still have many parts, but perhaps only 4-6 different types, repeated. I am trying to create a track that can be built assembly line style... alot of parts positioned on a page end-to-end so that they just need to be 'snipped off' instead of needing lots of exacto blade work for each one. In 1:16 scale it might not look as good as I hope, however but I think it's better to try it more modular first before going overkill.
  3. Bowdenja

    Bowdenja Active Member

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    Boy do I feel old.................. Key Largo...........Treasure of the Sierra Madre...... Casabalanca..........The Caine Mutiny......... The African Queen........Dark Passage........ Action in the North Atlantic..........To Have and To Have Not..............etc....

    Boy those were movies! I still have a thing for Lauren Bacall:grin:

    john
  4. Bowdenja

    Bowdenja Active Member

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    Boy do I feel old.................. Key Largo...........Treasure of the Sierra Madre...... Casabalanca..........The Caine Mutiny......... The African Queen........Dark Passage........ Action in the North Atlantic..........To Have and To Have Not..............etc....

    Boy those were movies! I still have a thing for Lauren Bacall:grin:

    john
  5. 57townsman

    57townsman Member

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    Great subject and off to a great start too! I had a 1/16 scale p****** kit way back when. That hull is definitely U shaped. Maybe for the extension arm bosses you could have rolled paper tubes that go clear through the hull. No drooping or tearing off that way :roll:

    SteveK
  6. 57townsman

    57townsman Member

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    Great subject and off to a great start too! I had a 1/16 scale p****** kit way back when. That hull is definitely U shaped. Maybe for the extension arm bosses you could have rolled paper tubes that go clear through the hull. No drooping or tearing off that way :roll:

    SteveK
  7. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    I was planning on using rolled paper. If you wind it thick and tight enough, with enough glue it practically IS wood when it dries- like those paper sticks for lolipops. I figure that they will be about 1/2" in diameter so they will be right strong. Can't just shove them thru from one side to the other though... left roadwheels are offset forward, rights to the rear; to allow room for two sets of torsion bars. I thought about doing that, but somebody would catch it, and it is a pretty standard feature on a tank. Any tankers out there have an opinion about that issue? If I cheated and ran them straight through will it be a big deal or not? You probably couldn't tell except from underneath.

    If I use paper I could wind it around the wire I will need for strength in the swingarms... that would give built in torsion bars- hmmm, the possiblity of suspension travel is intriguing.
  8. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    I was planning on using rolled paper. If you wind it thick and tight enough, with enough glue it practically IS wood when it dries- like those paper sticks for lolipops. I figure that they will be about 1/2" in diameter so they will be right strong. Can't just shove them thru from one side to the other though... left roadwheels are offset forward, rights to the rear; to allow room for two sets of torsion bars. I thought about doing that, but somebody would catch it, and it is a pretty standard feature on a tank. Any tankers out there have an opinion about that issue? If I cheated and ran them straight through will it be a big deal or not? You probably couldn't tell except from underneath.

    If I use paper I could wind it around the wire I will need for strength in the swingarms... that would give built in torsion bars- hmmm, the possiblity of suspension travel is intriguing.
  9. Rick Thomson

    Rick Thomson Member

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    Don't we all, John, don't we all.

    Rick.
  10. Rick Thomson

    Rick Thomson Member

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    Don't we all, John, don't we all.

    Rick.
  11. 57townsman

    57townsman Member

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    Offset axles. damn.:cry:
    Well, if you had a strong enough egg crate structure the axles could be well supported in holes in the frame. Just a thought, you've got plenty of time to work that out later :grin:

    SteveK
  12. 57townsman

    57townsman Member

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    Offset axles. damn.:cry:
    Well, if you had a strong enough egg crate structure the axles could be well supported in holes in the frame. Just a thought, you've got plenty of time to work that out later :grin:

    SteveK
  13. charliec

    charliec Active Member

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    A couple of comments....

    Torsion bars - I agree with the idea of rolled paper - these could easily be replaced with bamboo skewers if someone didn't want to roll them. Can I make a plea to make the bar diameter a whole mm size. It makes it easy to make up a guage from a piece of thick card using a hole punch. (Modelik uses this technique a lot in their AFV models). I'm not sure I like taking the torsion bar shrouds straight through the hull - I bet they've got a taper on them in the original. The offset of the road wheels is (imho) a good thing to model - there are so many models which don't do this - just makes the design look under-researched or poorly implemented. Perhaps check out how Marian Sobel designed the Halinski Tiger torsion bars in the Tiger build thread on this forum.

    Swing arms - I don't think you need to put a wire core through the swing arm if you've got enough contact area between the torsion bar and the swing arm to make a good glue joint.

    Tracks - I recently did a thread on an idea for building tracks - it was based on starting with strip tracks and adding details. I'll have to check the M48 tracks but I'd guess they are the usual US practice of frame with rubber insert. I agree individual links are a pain to do - certainly I'd offer both strip and individual link track designs.

    Regards,

    Charlie
  14. charliec

    charliec Active Member

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    A couple of comments....

    Torsion bars - I agree with the idea of rolled paper - these could easily be replaced with bamboo skewers if someone didn't want to roll them. Can I make a plea to make the bar diameter a whole mm size. It makes it easy to make up a guage from a piece of thick card using a hole punch. (Modelik uses this technique a lot in their AFV models). I'm not sure I like taking the torsion bar shrouds straight through the hull - I bet they've got a taper on them in the original. The offset of the road wheels is (imho) a good thing to model - there are so many models which don't do this - just makes the design look under-researched or poorly implemented. Perhaps check out how Marian Sobel designed the Halinski Tiger torsion bars in the Tiger build thread on this forum.

    Swing arms - I don't think you need to put a wire core through the swing arm if you've got enough contact area between the torsion bar and the swing arm to make a good glue joint.

    Tracks - I recently did a thread on an idea for building tracks - it was based on starting with strip tracks and adding details. I'll have to check the M48 tracks but I'd guess they are the usual US practice of frame with rubber insert. I agree individual links are a pain to do - certainly I'd offer both strip and individual link track designs.

    Regards,

    Charlie
  15. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    Thanks Charlie, I will check out tha Tiger build. And I might need to get my hands on one too. The idea about the wire doing a 'Z' bend thru the torsion bar, swingarm, and wheel was mainly to keep the swingarms stiff and straight, not really to reinforce the junction to the bosses on the hull. I think it could also allow for rotating wheels. I'm sure this thing will get whittled down to reality as I go on and run into things that I just can't do.
  16. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    Thanks Charlie, I will check out tha Tiger build. And I might need to get my hands on one too. The idea about the wire doing a 'Z' bend thru the torsion bar, swingarm, and wheel was mainly to keep the swingarms stiff and straight, not really to reinforce the junction to the bosses on the hull. I think it could also allow for rotating wheels. I'm sure this thing will get whittled down to reality as I go on and run into things that I just can't do.
  17. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    More images of the model coming along. The basic turret and hull are there. Now there is ALOT of junk to hang on to them.
  18. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    More images of the model coming along. The basic turret and hull are there. Now there is ALOT of junk to hang on to them.
  19. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    images

    Oops, here are the images (or links if I still can't do it right).
    The turret turned out to be a challenge- so many compund curves. And no at all symmetrical, except along the base. This is actually my second turret- the first was too sliced up- it looked really smooth but would never have held up in paper. This one I think will work well. I can't wait to color this thing. The two we have up here at the museum are filthy- and I want to get that look.
  20. John Griffin

    John Griffin Member

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    images

    Oops, here are the images (or links if I still can't do it right).
    The turret turned out to be a challenge- so many compund curves. And no at all symmetrical, except along the base. This is actually my second turret- the first was too sliced up- it looked really smooth but would never have held up in paper. This one I think will work well. I can't wait to color this thing. The two we have up here at the museum are filthy- and I want to get that look.