How to pull 3d models?

Discussion in 'Tips, Tutorials & Tools' started by generaldiaz, Oct 2, 2014.

  1. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    so I was stumbling around tor head today and I noticed that on some of the weapons had a 3d model that could be viewed. I know I have heard people pulling 3d models from games and such and being able to use those as a basis of their models. my question is would there be away to pull 3d models from that place to use to make the models. im sure it is well over my head, but if it is possible I would love to learn how to do it to set a goal for the future, if anyone knows how to do it.
    link -> http://www.torhead.com/item/dPSHBQY/troopers-birthright-autocannon
  2. Cybergrinder

    Cybergrinder Member Extraordinaire

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    Hi Gerneraldiaz, what game is it from? If you google "convert (game & extension that the game uses) to 3ds/obj file"you can usually find something that will convert the file to a *.obj, or *.3ds file that you can then edit with Sketchup or other 3d editing software. from there you can use pepakuria to unfold the model.

    From my own experience I used Milkshape to pull *.mod files from Starfleet Command to *.3ds files.

    That said, it's not a job for the faint hearted! ;)
  3. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    it is from star wars the old republic. I am not sure if the model is from the game itself or if the 3d model was created for the website that I linked to. the model is viewed with adobe flash, im not sure if that makes a difference at all?
  4. Cybergrinder

    Cybergrinder Member Extraordinaire

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    Shucks, I'm going to have to bail on you here, as I'm out of my depth :( But, some of the other regulars are much more experienced in model design. Hopefully they can guide you more than I can.
  5. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    yeah I am way out of my depth also, that is why I asked. it would save me a lot of time on each model it I could go right from 3d model working on unfolding. I would love to hear from the more experienced people. hint, hint, ;), ;)....
  6. Cybergrinder

    Cybergrinder Member Extraordinaire

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    If the model was designed to be used in the game I'm sure there's a converter somewhere....

    I was able to pull the models from X-Wing Alliance (*opt to 3ds) quite easily once I found the converter.

    The other thing that happens with game based models is there is usually quite a bit of "overlap" the the different parts of the model intersect & become a pain in the backside when making the model. (x-Wing Alliance models...)

    Revell-fan helped me with my USS Defiant (currently under construction, have a look at my build thread ;))
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2014
  7. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    To be honest, if you have to ask the question, it's above your present knowledge level. There are so many things you have to learn first, and certain types of software, CAD and the like, has to be something you work with all the time. That being said, there are some people who make unbelievably detailed models just using "Paint", yup, plain old Microsoft (no loner) "Paint", which is still freely available, and is better than ever.

    Get that, start by making a simple box. Then a pyramid, a cone, a cylinder, using past geometry lessons, these formulas are found easily on the web. Four cylinders and a rectangle with a smaller trapezoid on top, you've made your first car. All models are made from simple primitives. :)
  8. daishi

    daishi Member

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    Hi there!

    I'm usually making my templates based on models pulled from games. Most older games you just need a converter that can convert the format the game uses to something usable by editor. (as mentioned in previous posts)

    For newer ones you usually need an extractor that can get the models (still in the game format) from the container files, then convert them to something useful. (e.g. Unreal Engine 3 uses .upk files which you have to get the .psk models from which you can convert to something useful, oh and on some occasions upk files are in another container file for reasons like its part of a dlc or whatnot)

    There are also programs that can make "model screenshots" of the screen that is on your monitor at the moments, as in dumping the mesh and the textures on your HDD from the VRAM. I think most games have some sort of protection against it, and the newer DirectX versions are also either unsupported or protected against this (I can be wrong though I generally don't use this method.)

    Also yeah game models are usually messy as hell internally with a lot of clipping that you have to clean up if you want to unfold. I guess it depends on your skills which one is faster: building a model or cleaning up a game one. I for one know enough about 3D modelling to clean up the models internally fairly decently, even to lower the poly count to a build-able level, but I couldn't build a decent 3D model if my life depended on it from scratch.

    As for the site you liked in, I don't actually know how hard would it be to get that particular model, never tried to pull one from a website before. From my admittedly limited knowledge of browser based 3D rendering I think it would be fairly well embedded in the site so accessing it wouldn't be trivial.
  9. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    yeah I figured it was way above me, I could build them in cad or sketch up, but I as hoping if there was an easy way to do it, to pull models from the game or website and save the time of building and go right to cleanup. if not, I will do it old school, that way still works. but hey, as they say "nothing ventured, nothing gained."
  10. Cybergrinder

    Cybergrinder Member Extraordinaire

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  11. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    Virtually eery model I have seen ripped from a game looks "like a model ripped from a game". The graphics are dull, and it is just a shell that ends up being a waste of time. I won't build them. If you do CAD you are better off getting Meshes and finding the lines, or making the lines that will allow you to unfold a detailed, good model. Do something original. Leave the game models in the games. Reference is one thing. I haven't seen not a one that I would bother building. If you know CAD, use it! My two cents worth. :)
  12. Cybergrinder

    Cybergrinder Member Extraordinaire

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    What you say is true Zathros, but for us "ameteur" designers game based models are a great place to start. What also affects the look of the game based model is how "compatable" the game model is to unfolding. The USS Defiant I did is a bad example (it was mirrored, lots of overlaps, and some gaps), however, models pulled from X-Wing Alliance actually don't look too bad, and can be greebled up to your hearts desire.

    I've built a few game extracted models (rebel fighters (except A-Wing) in my intro thread) and have to say that I'm quite happy with the way they came out. I'm actually thinking of working on the Nebulon B frigate from X-Wing Alliance (upgraded by X-Wing Allilance Upgrade project) soon. :)
  13. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    Please, take my statements as general. I should back peddle from that statement and will because some people who pull models, then do the graphics right make some really good stuff. I think if you can do CAD though, it is better to work with the model in the "Perspective view port and create your own lines and surfaces. I am always willing to help out on parts. To be honest, I'd rather help someone by designing, or helping them design parts, than make a whole model myself. It may be from being a machinist for almost 20 years, and being used to making parts, not the "whole" thing. So, if i can help, let me know. I can easily pull a "wireframe" from a "Mesh" which will allow you to make and chose how to put together anything you wish. The wire frame becomes lines by which you can work with, snapping to midpoints, tangency's, end points, which sometimes, while being able to do with meshes, the whole meshes are too complicated, so this way, you can break them down and then put them back together into something that unfolds. The trick to this is making points that you know are where the meshes go back together. I work exclusively with meshes, and if I cannot find one, I make my own. Glad to help, if I can. I don't do well on tiny teeny models though. Too many tradeoffs. there are some on this forum like Linsweregon, who are masters at this, gotta mention Spaceagent9 too. :)
  14. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    what is your opinion of google sketch up? I have found some models for that program, but when I try to actually unfold them, I get a jumbled mess that looks like mutant snowflakes and end up with a million (ok maybe not that much) little useless parts that would be too small to work with. is that part of not having the license or as I suspect an inherent part of the models that becomes problematic during unfolding?
  15. Rhaven Blaack

    Rhaven Blaack ADMINISTRATOR Administrator

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    For Google Sketchup, contact @Revell-Fan. He is good at using this program. He should be able to answer all (or at least most) of your questions.
    generaldiaz likes this.
  16. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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  17. Revell-Fan

    Revell-Fan Co-Administrator Administrator

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    What? ME???? Sorry, I don't know anything about it ..! :Grin::Grin::Grin:
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2014
  18. Revell-Fan

    Revell-Fan Co-Administrator Administrator

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    OK, joking aside. I assume these little bits are scattered all over the page and are triangular? I have encountered them as well on more than one occasion. It is always very annoying when this happens because you'll have to edit the unfold in a graphic program later to put these bits back to their original locations. The main reason for that is that the mesh has some flaws Pepakura cannot compensate. Pepakura works best with Metasequioa; if a model is made in a different program it is a case of /good or bad) luck if the unfold looks good.

    If you get unnecessary parts it seems that the model hasn't been cleaned up first. Like zathros said, these models were designed for CG renderings, animations or thereof and not for papercrafting. This is absolutely no flaw by the author of the model; I am sure he / she would have been able to avoid that IF he / she had designed the model for unfolding. In addition, many of the models are so complex that it is not possible to build them. They have to be adapted and simplified to accomodate the requirements of the target medium.

    You should always keep in mind that Pepakura's unfolding procedure is not very intelligent. Faces are detected, unfolded and displayed in a rather crude way. Frankly, the program does not need to do any better ;) . It is up to you to alter the unfold using the editing functions of the program.
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  19. generaldiaz

    generaldiaz New Member

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    Metasequioa? I have never heard of that before.

    with some of the models, is it internal faces that are being picked up or I have seen some models where I had to zoom inside the model to uncheck lines but it was still pretty bad.
  20. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    I honestly thought Metaseqouia was tree? As in, that was the biggest F'ckn Metaseqouia I've ever seen! :)
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