Full hulls without too many tears

Discussion in 'Ship & Watercraft Models' started by barry, Feb 12, 2007.

  1. eibwarrior

    eibwarrior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2005
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    0
    Excellent Barry. Those colors look pretty close to me. The haze gray and black are right on for sure. I'm sure allignment of color lines is going to be the real challenge.

    I've never done a dazzle pattern on a card model, so I'm sure it will be a real test of ability.
  2. eibwarrior

    eibwarrior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2005
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    0
    Excellent Barry. Those colors look pretty close to me. The haze gray and black are right on for sure. I'm sure allignment of color lines is going to be the real challenge.

    I've never done a dazzle pattern on a card model, so I'm sure it will be a real test of ability.
  3. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ships ladders

    i don't mind the fact that the ship rails I produce are overlays but I have never been able to produce good ladders by this method. This is my latest try I stuck a piece of double sided heavy duty sticky tape to an old piece of steel rule quite useful because of the built in measurement. It does sort of cut out the fact my hands shake at this level.

    I cut the rungs way over size and carefully stuck them hard against the first side of the ladder and held them in place with a popsicle stick as well and soldered the first side. Then I cut the rungs to length with a Stanley blade butted the other side up to the cut rails and then holding the first side and rungs down with the stick soldered them together. Please forgive the result it's only my second try and there is a definate knack to it. However in place on the ship it don't look too bad.

    The reason for this piece of madness is there is a ladder all the way up the front of the foremast on the Gearing.


    If anyone has any hints I would appreciate it

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Thanks for the comments Elb.

    The trick with razor blades works a treat I tried to use the blade to hold down the ladder bits but I ended up soldering it to the steps !
  4. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ships ladders

    i don't mind the fact that the ship rails I produce are overlays but I have never been able to produce good ladders by this method. This is my latest try I stuck a piece of double sided heavy duty sticky tape to an old piece of steel rule quite useful because of the built in measurement. It does sort of cut out the fact my hands shake at this level.

    I cut the rungs way over size and carefully stuck them hard against the first side of the ladder and held them in place with a popsicle stick as well and soldered the first side. Then I cut the rungs to length with a Stanley blade butted the other side up to the cut rails and then holding the first side and rungs down with the stick soldered them together. Please forgive the result it's only my second try and there is a definate knack to it. However in place on the ship it don't look too bad.

    The reason for this piece of madness is there is a ladder all the way up the front of the foremast on the Gearing.


    If anyone has any hints I would appreciate it

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Thanks for the comments Elb.

    The trick with razor blades works a treat I tried to use the blade to hold down the ladder bits but I ended up soldering it to the steps !
  5. Gregory Shoda

    Gregory Shoda Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Messages:
    235
    Likes Received:
    0
    Computer work

    Barry:

    You sure are a marvel with the computer! Nice camouflage pattern.
  6. Gregory Shoda

    Gregory Shoda Member

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2004
    Messages:
    235
    Likes Received:
    0
    Computer work

    Barry:

    You sure are a marvel with the computer! Nice camouflage pattern.
  7. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2004
    Messages:
    509
    Likes Received:
    2
    So it turns out the blades are in greater danger from you than you are from them. :grin:
    For the ladders perhaps wind a stick in the same way as for the rails. (no I don't have shares in fuse wire)
  8. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2004
    Messages:
    509
    Likes Received:
    2
    So it turns out the blades are in greater danger from you than you are from them. :grin:
    For the ladders perhaps wind a stick in the same way as for the rails. (no I don't have shares in fuse wire)
  9. mpakier

    mpakier Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hello

    I was making a ladder in my Ambrose ship.

    Here you can see the ladder made from paper.

    Or you can make a hybrid where the vertical parts (sorry for the name
    but I don't know how to call it in english) are made from steel wire
    and the rungs from paper (or opposite as you wish). I have a picture
    here that I did not used in my Ambrose thread.

    [​IMG]

    I think that the idea is clearly shown on the picture. You cut out the
    rungs from paper using a knife. It is really doable try and you will see.
    Then you glue the wires in right places. I think that it is also possible
    to make it whole from wires (but I didn't try). You make a square
    hole in a piece of paper and glue the rungs to the paper on both sides
    of the hole. Then you glue the vertical wires to the rungs.
  10. mpakier

    mpakier Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hello

    I was making a ladder in my Ambrose ship.

    Here you can see the ladder made from paper.

    Or you can make a hybrid where the vertical parts (sorry for the name
    but I don't know how to call it in english) are made from steel wire
    and the rungs from paper (or opposite as you wish). I have a picture
    here that I did not used in my Ambrose thread.

    [​IMG]

    I think that the idea is clearly shown on the picture. You cut out the
    rungs from paper using a knife. It is really doable try and you will see.
    Then you glue the wires in right places. I think that it is also possible
    to make it whole from wires (but I didn't try). You make a square
    hole in a piece of paper and glue the rungs to the paper on both sides
    of the hole. Then you glue the vertical wires to the rungs.
  11. Gil

    Gil Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,981
    Likes Received:
    0
    Possible Solution

    Barry,

    I've been thinking about ships rails for some time now and your dilemma brought the thought to the fore.

    Basically, the thinking goes something like this; Use fixed basket weave style frame but instead let it be a parallelogram. If wire is placed between two opposing sides the strands will come ever closer as the structure is deformed into a diamond shape. The idea is to setup the wire on parallel sides which when positioned at say a 60 degree angle will be one half of what the distance was when the sides were perpendicular. So a one millimeter spacing would become 0.5 mm when angled at 60 degrees. The same can be done for the cross pieces. The whole idea is to gain miniature precision by a dividing technique and which will also hold the wire firmly in position while it's being soldered.

    Also preparing the wire by pre-tinning it prior to rigging in the frames will simplify the soldering job. On second thought as long as the wire has a clean surface this could be performed with the wire already rigged in the frame. One las point is this method lends itself to making quite a few at one time.

    -Gil
  12. Gil

    Gil Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2004
    Messages:
    1,981
    Likes Received:
    0
    Possible Solution

    Barry,

    I've been thinking about ships rails for some time now and your dilemma brought the thought to the fore.

    Basically, the thinking goes something like this; Use fixed basket weave style frame but instead let it be a parallelogram. If wire is placed between two opposing sides the strands will come ever closer as the structure is deformed into a diamond shape. The idea is to setup the wire on parallel sides which when positioned at say a 60 degree angle will be one half of what the distance was when the sides were perpendicular. So a one millimeter spacing would become 0.5 mm when angled at 60 degrees. The same can be done for the cross pieces. The whole idea is to gain miniature precision by a dividing technique and which will also hold the wire firmly in position while it's being soldered.

    Also preparing the wire by pre-tinning it prior to rigging in the frames will simplify the soldering job. On second thought as long as the wire has a clean surface this could be performed with the wire already rigged in the frame. One las point is this method lends itself to making quite a few at one time.

    -Gil
  13. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gil bless you ! my old brain is having difficulty fully visualising this method any chance of a sketch

    Maurice of course I use fuse wire old mate ever since you told me about it can't tin thin wire to save my life for some reason and this stuff is tinned already

    Mpakir thanks fot the idea but the rungs would be too deep for what I want they are great as climbing rigging tho.

    Gregory thanks for the kind words

    probably I am trying for the impossible again but that's what it is all about

    regards
  14. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gil bless you ! my old brain is having difficulty fully visualising this method any chance of a sketch

    Maurice of course I use fuse wire old mate ever since you told me about it can't tin thin wire to save my life for some reason and this stuff is tinned already

    Mpakir thanks fot the idea but the rungs would be too deep for what I want they are great as climbing rigging tho.

    Gregory thanks for the kind words

    probably I am trying for the impossible again but that's what it is all about

    regards
  15. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Dazzle test

    Not in the mood to be serious at the moment so I did a quick test on the hull it's just barely stuck on with old doublesided tape just about falling off. The flash is didyorting the colours quite a bit.

    Unfortunately it has shown up an error on the mesh for Gearing got to fix that now I think I know what silly trick I did though.

    [​IMG]
  16. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    Dazzle test

    Not in the mood to be serious at the moment so I did a quick test on the hull it's just barely stuck on with old doublesided tape just about falling off. The flash is didyorting the colours quite a bit.

    Unfortunately it has shown up an error on the mesh for Gearing got to fix that now I think I know what silly trick I did though.

    [​IMG]
  17. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2004
    Messages:
    509
    Likes Received:
    2
    Barry

    I was looking at your pics and reckoning you could achieve a regular layout for the ladders with something like what I've drawn here. It will waste a bit of wire though.
  18. Maurice

    Maurice Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2004
    Messages:
    509
    Likes Received:
    2
    Barry

    I was looking at your pics and reckoning you could achieve a regular layout for the ladders with something like what I've drawn here. It will waste a bit of wire though.
  19. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    That's the way you taught me in the distant past Maurice and I have been using it on the main rails. I was really trying to emulate Rob who just produced ladders with rungs level with the sides with such apparent ease but then he could solder. However just had a look at the ones on Norfolk and I doubt I would see the difference really maybe I should try gluing the wires between 2 thin strips of card heavily soaked in pva.
  20. barry

    barry Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Messages:
    2,369
    Likes Received:
    0
    That's the way you taught me in the distant past Maurice and I have been using it on the main rails. I was really trying to emulate Rob who just produced ladders with rungs level with the sides with such apparent ease but then he could solder. However just had a look at the ones on Norfolk and I doubt I would see the difference really maybe I should try gluing the wires between 2 thin strips of card heavily soaked in pva.