Ferrari Engine design and build

Discussion in 'Commercial & Civilian Vehicles' started by retunga, Aug 21, 2012.

  1. Rhaven Blaack

    Rhaven Blaack ADMINISTRATOR Administrator

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    You are doing a PHENOMINAL JOB on this model!
    I fully understand what it is like to make the same part multiple times and to make certain that all are built properly. It is indeed very difficult. Doing such though is a true testiment to ones own patience and skill.
    KEEP UP THR GREAT WORK!!!
  2. Revell-Fan

    Revell-Fan Co-Administrator Administrator

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    :cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool::cool:

    VROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMM!!!!!!!

    Too bad these parts can't be used as real replacement parts... Maybe you'll get the chance to add the outer hull around it, too! Just imagine, a complete full size Ferrari - from paper! Anyway, the work you show here is absolutely incredible. And I know it is a real pain in the trunk to make so many equal parts..!

    Keep it on! :thumb:
  3. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Well here is a few photos of the testing to get the shimming and spacing problems fixed, lucky yesterday was a public holiday so what better way to fix the problem.

    What I found to be the best way to check for spacing problems was to pre-assemble the engine vertical way as below and get the conrods and cutaway opening both parallel and it worked. :mrgreen:

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    closer view of the engine

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    So Now can start the gluing of the engine and it can now look like something othere than a 50+ parts in a box.
    :mrgreen::twisted:

    R
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  4. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    OMG!! If looks like you have the guts to an engine on your table!! That has to be one of the most impressive builds I have ever seen! :)
  5. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    At last the engine block, pistons and crank is all now together!!!!!:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

    Here is a few photos of the building of the block, crank and pistons in place.

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    More completed view with all the parts.

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    The next part that I want need to build to atleast finish off the assembly of the block is the stands that will hold the whole model.

    :twisted:

    R
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  6. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Update time :mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

    Well I can now say that the engine lives.... but not without it's teething problems, I have had to re-visit the gears as my first version did not last for very long in that of making gear teeth time by one and died after the first test.

    What I have now done is designed all the gears to made up of 1.2mm stock card and glued together to make up 6mm and from there one would then have a gear that will not die after 1/2 a turn.

    I have tested the engine up to 35 rpm and it holds out quite well, any problems of binding or questionable parts will show, and at the end of the test I just had a small amount of paper dust.

    I have included a video of the engine block turning at 35 rpm

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    This is the video that is below :thumb:

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    Enjoy
    :mrgreen::thumb::cool:
    R
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  7. Revell-Fan

    Revell-Fan Co-Administrator Administrator

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    [​IMG]

    :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb:
  8. Rhaven Blaack

    Rhaven Blaack ADMINISTRATOR Administrator

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    2012112293329_most-impressive-darth-vader[1].jpg
    :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb: :thumb::thumb::thumb:
  9. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    I would suggest that you get "Gap filling" Crazy Glue and coat the gear surfaces many many time. This will harden the surfaces and will also provide some needed slippage, as I am sure there is much friction with paper gears. I might even consider getting thing plastic sheet stock and facing the gears with it. This comes in very very thin sheets of varying thickness. This will solve many problems. Just a suggestion. :)
  10. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Thanks Zathros for the suggestion, do you know of any webpages that sell the stuff that you are writing about to see if I can get my hands on it.

    :)
    R
  11. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Update time...

    For the last month or so I have been cutting gears and gears and gears as below

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    This has been the only way that I have found to work the centers of the gears to size that I need before doing the mass cutting exerise.


    [​IMG]
    180 of so parts that will make up the gears at the end of the day.

    So this weekend I shall start the assembly of the gears and from there I will then start the construction of the timing plates and LED controls for the spark plugs that will be needed later.
    :)
    R
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  12. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    This kind of stuff (Spread it with a metal pin as you apply to smooth out):

    http://www.amazon.com/Bob-Smith-108...&sr=8-3-fkmr0&keywords=gap filling crazy glue

    That engine block is fantastic!! I would honestly consider making the smaller gear out of two part steel epoxy. Use the cardboard ones as a plug, coat them with the crazy clue, then when they have dried, coat them with Vaseline, as a release agent, and press them into steel epoxy putty that you have kneaded together. I would then remove the card board plug, file any that needs to be in the mold, apply Vaseline as a releasing agent, and fill that with 2 part steel epoxy and remove when hardened. It will last much longer, as it will be taking many more rpm's. You could make flats on the metal sleeve inside the gear to hold it in place in the hardened putty (the sleeve with the lock screw would be placed in the mold and the steel putty pressed in, using a pine to keep everything centered) , then slide onto the electric motor. You can mill Steel Epoxy quite nicely. Just an idea. :)

    [​IMG]
  13. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Well a bit of an update on the engine build,
    bad news the engine gear work that I have for the last 2 months or so has been a bit of a problem, the ratio that one needs to get the crank to the cam is 2:1 step down in speed for a 4 stroke engine which fine buyt the way that I have gone about doing the 2:1 with gears has not worked out, it works out to 1.1109:1 stepdown wall1

    after looking at what I did in calculations and and the gear setup, I have picked up my mistake, in calcalations I used compond gear ratio instead of gear train :curse: and the way that I set the gears up was in gear train not gear train and compond combo. wall1wall1

    So the photo below is the worng way of doing it .

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    This is the correct way of doing it

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    After going through my engineering books and double checking with a engineer friends did I find out how bad the mistake was. :oops::oops:wall1wall1

    When doing gearing there is a few different types of gearing methods:
    1: Gear train
    2: Compond Gearing
    3: Epicycle Gear Train (Planetary)

    Where I went wrong is by fixing it up in the following way.

    G1=9t
    G2=12t
    G3=10t
    G4=15t
    G5=10t
    G6=10t
    G7=10t

    Compond gear ratio is work out in the following method:

    R = G2/G1 * G4/G3 and the reat been 1:1 so you leave that out of the formula.

    R = 1.33333_ * 1.5
    R = 2 which is what I wanted.

    oops WRONG !!!

    the real ratio is as follows with gear train:

    R = G2/G1 * G3/G2 * G4/G3 * G5/G4 * G6/G5 * G7/G6

    R = 1.3333_ * 0.8333_ * 1.5 * 0.666_ * 1 * 1
    R = 1.1109 WRONG RATIO !!!!!

    So what I have had to do is the following:
    combine gear train and compond gearing to get this to work.

    G1=10t
    G2=10t
    G3=10t
    G4=10t
    G5=9t
    G6=18t
    G7=10t
    G8=10t
    G9=10t
    G10=10t

    So now the formula will look like this:

    R = (G2/G1 * G3/G2 * G4/G3) * (G6/G5) * (G8/G7 * G9/G8 * G10/G9)
    R = 1 * 2 * 1
    R = 2 CORRECT !!!!

    Now the correct ratio is now obtained 2:1 step down.

    All that is means is that I have to scrap 6 gears and make 7 gears to fix the error, thankfully I was testing the gears that they where meshing correctly of which I have had to dress the gears round to get them to work smoothly and in so doing that is where I picked the error up....

    So at the end of the day I have learnt something make sure you use the correct formula's and method when calulating.:oops:


    :thumb::cool:
  14. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    Geez, at least you know the formula's!! I'd bee scratching my head till I was bald or just had a stump off neck! I wished we lived close by. I have a milling machine an we could have cut those gears all at once time by stacking the blanks, bolting down the center hole for location and cutting (each facet), gang milling, and since I have an indexing table, it would have been easy to rotate each facet till the gears were done.

    This is one of the most impressive models and builds I've ever seen! :)
  15. Strode

    Strode New Member

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    all those words made a whooshing noise as they flew clear above my head. wish i was capable of doing even a 10th of what you have accomplished here...
  16. Rogerio Silva

    Rogerio Silva Active Member

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    Too much...

    I'd be happy with a 100th! sign1
  17. vbsargent

    vbsargent Member

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    As Shakespeare said in "Julius Caesar"

    "for mine own part, it was Greek to me." :mrgreen:

    vbsargent
  18. Revell-Fan

    Revell-Fan Co-Administrator Administrator

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    The answer is always ... 42! :mrgreen:
  19. retunga

    retunga Designer

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    Well at last after months of work and 1 re-design later and the timing section of the model is now complete.

    Here is a few build photos from this section of work.

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    At the Start of the timing plate

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    Completed internals

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    Completed timing plate

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    Timing ring

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    Timing Assembly work

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    Timing ring in place

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    Completed Assembly work

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    Now the Cylinder head work can now be done next ....
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  20. zathros

    zathros -----SENIOR---- Administrator

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    Watching those pistons move up and down, especially so fast, was most impressive. I'd seriously think about using a potentiometer so you could slow it down and let the symphony of the parts be enjoyed. A couple of Lexan valve covers to show the valve train moving would be nice too! Incredible! :)