double swicthI plan on insalling

Discussion in 'HO Scale Model Trains' started by John Sneed, Jan 13, 2003.

  1. John Sneed

    John Sneed Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2001
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    I plan on insalling a double crossover on my layout and I was going to ask about the wireing for it.I am going to order the one in Walthers as that about the only one I've seen.Is there much of a problem with the wireing of one? Wireing is not one of my strong points.Of course I don't have to many strong points to begain with,so I'am behind be fore I start.But, I try.

    John
  2. Gary Pfeil

    Gary Pfeil Active Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Messages:
    2,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    John, You may want to consider using four Atlas turnouts anda crossover instead of a prebuilt double xover. The prebuilt one is by Shinohara, isn't it? You won't enjoy wiring it. I believe Bob Collins made a double xover from Atlas components, you may want to ask him.
  3. Ben H

    Ben H Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2002
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    0
    That's what this hobby is about - developing strong points.

    If you are going to be using DCC then double slip switchs need some work (I believe and so does Allan Gartner- at DCC Friendly Switchs ), if you are going to do Block wiring with out DCC then the extra wiring is not needed.

    You might want to check the Gauge for info by searching (use one of the buttons at the top left). Further my Double Slip post has some good comments about slip switches
  4. Gary Pfeil

    Gary Pfeil Active Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2001
    Messages:
    2,594
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ben, He's talking double xover, not double slip.
  5. 60103

    60103 Pooh Bah

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2002
    Messages:
    5,141
    Likes Received:
    0
    Wiring a double crossover is one of the ugliest jobs you can tackle. We had an RTR one that was replaced by a single because we never got the whole thing working.
    Can you wire a simple crossing? If you can do that, you may be able to go on to the double cross.
    Much of the wiring has to be done using the extra contacts on your switch machines. You may even need extra relay blades.
  6. John Sneed

    John Sneed Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2001
    Messages:
    82
    Likes Received:
    0
    john sneed

    Is it possible to use manuel ground throws instead of wireing it for remote control for a double crossover? That may be away to can around the wireing porblems.

    John
  7. 60103

    60103 Pooh Bah

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2002
    Messages:
    5,141
    Likes Received:
    0
    sorry John, but the switch machines are not only the least of your wiring problems, they're the solution to most of them.
    Draw out the crossover and look at how each of the frogs has to be powered - there's one on each turnout and 4 on the crossing. The power on the crossing will depend on which way the turnouts are thrown.
    Is there a sample at the hobby shop you can look at, with instructions?
    How it's wired may depend on where the manufacturer put insulated gaps, and also if you use DCC or plain DC power.
  8. Woodie

    Woodie Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    2,228
    Likes Received:
    0
    John, I put in a double crossover on my payout. (oops, typo. I meant "layout") :):) I used 4 turnouts and a crossover. (peco electrofrog) and Peco turnout motors.
    All you need to do is insulate correctly. It may be a bit difficult to describe, but put siumply, just insulate all the turnout rails at one end. (ie, say, the two "left hand end" turnouts.) where they join with the crossover AND the straight thru track. This will prevent shorts. Then just let the feed in tracks do the powering from each end of the entire setup. However, if your inside track is running left to right (powered) and the outside track is running right to left, you'll get a polarity problem as you run "across" the double crossover of course, as your loco will try to "reverse" to match the direction of the other track, as it crosses the insulated joiners. (or make sure you have the appropriate "block" switched through to the appropriate controller.

    As for the turnout motors, you might as well have all four connected to the one throw switch. The "switched mode" is only really, useful in "two modes". Crossover, or straight through for <I>both</I> tracks. That way, you will prevent accidental derailments, if you forget to reset the "mode" correctly using indvidual throw switches. ie. top left turnout and bottom right only (to switch from inside to outside). Train comes the other way, and BOOM through one turnout, and derails on the one you have not reset!!

    I had a problem here, as my power source for the turnout motors was not powerful enough to throw all four switches through the one switch/circuit at once. I ended up with two switch/circuits. One for each end of the double crossover.

    Hope this helps. Let me know if I've got you a bit confuddled. :):):)
  9. boppa

    boppa Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2002
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    0
    waves at woodie


    this sounds like a digital answer

    humm-prog and sell digital ic's with pre/post prog turnout configurations....hummmmm
  10. boppa

    boppa Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2002
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    0
    so whats happening with Garahbara??
    its up here now??

    (btw-the skys getting light right about.....now)
  11. boppa

    boppa Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2002
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    0
    . This will prevent shorts. Then just let the feed in tracks do the powering from each end of the entire setup. However, if your inside track is running left to right (powered) and the outside track is running right to left, you'll get a polarity problem as you run "across" the double crossover of course, as your loco will try to "reverse" to match the direction of the other track, as it crosses the insulated joiners. (or make sure you have the appropriate "block" switched through to the appropriate controller.


    with a `liddle' electronics

    even nastys like coco d/e that insist on shorting loopbacks etc
    can be safely ignored
    after repairing an old triang(anyone remember these) dc/pulsed dc controllers used for first time in years

    od stock,old track,old everything
    including AFTER it happened the old long loco short(one truck left rail,one right truck rail

    result-small fuse bang-big fuse why my rails glowing????
  12. Woodie

    Woodie Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2001
    Messages:
    2,228
    Likes Received:
    0
    Garahbara? It's going to that great loco depot in the sky when I get back to Sydney this week. Not bringing it with me when I move. :(:(

    Getting light? Sheesh... it is too.

    "train whistle blowin',
    makes a sleepy noise,
    underneath the blankets
    for all the girls and boys...
    Rock and roll and riding,
    out along the bay,
    All bound for morning town
    many miles away.......
    Somewhere there is sunshine,
    somwhere there is rain,
    All bound for morning town,
    Many miles away......

    zzzzzzzzzzzzz...... :):)
  13. boppa

    boppa Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2002
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    0
    :-(


    why scrapping-space-moving costs what??
    99 % i could `fix'

    after all am in trucking game lol
  14. Rusted

    Rusted Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2002
    Messages:
    77
    Likes Received:
    0
    I just installed a double crossover using 4 atlas #4s and a 19 degree cross (I think it was a 19 degree, I took the design right from the Atlas track planning book - back pages have exactly what you need to make the crossovers including the little shorty's that give you the proper distance for the separation of the parallel tracks).

    The crossover connects two loops on my son's 4x8. Each loop is its own block. I isolated the cross over on all 4 rails from contact with the outer loop (not necessary, but gives equal spacing, rather than isolating just one - then I ran leads to both sets of rails on the inner and outer ciricle).

    We switch them manually and have had no problems running it as a figure eight upon itself or as two loops.

    We used #4s to save space - #6s would have been nice but very lengthy.