Designing Ju-87 Stuka

Discussion in 'Gallery & Designs' started by Bmer, May 2, 2007.

  1. Lex

    Lex Dollmaker

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    I agree. And $195 is quite a price...... Comparing with just buying surfmaster, why not buy a full version of Rhino instead? (I maybe saying nonsense for I don't know the full functionality of surfmaster)

    --I'll stop here, this is too far off the main topic :) No more on CAD software
  2. cmdrted

    cmdrted Active Member

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    As far as other versions ,The C model, a Navalized B Stuka From the Graf Zepplin might be a great subject.
  3. Bmer

    Bmer New Member

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    Hmm...I think I'll stick with the A-1, since I already started the preliminary drawings and stuff.

    Anyways, I'll get working on it, and post shots of my progress as I finish stuff. As I mentioned earlier, I have my exams coming up soon too, so I won't have a lot of time to spend on building the airplane, but I'll try to spend as much time as I can on it.

    Let's see how I do! :grin:
  4. cjwalas

    cjwalas Member

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  5. Bmer

    Bmer New Member

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    Thanks for the encouragement, and the pics! I hadn't seen those ones before. The cross-sections should come in handy and interior views of the cockpit should come in handy!
  6. Emil_Zarkov

    Emil_Zarkov Member

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    Hi Bmer and all,
    There are many Shtukas’ kits and each of them represents not only the peculiarities of the real thing in its time. The kits represent also the style of their design.
    For example I hate weathering as an inevitable part of the kit. I also hate shading by gradient masks. I prefer to leave the shadows on the model to be produced by its geometry and the current illumination, but not with the glittering textures that are very well accepted when the models parts are still on the sheet. When build in 3D space they produce unpleasant visual effects. It’s my opinion and it affects my style of the card models design.
    So go ahead and try to find your own representation style of the real thing as a model, accenting to some set of its peculiarities that you find the most significant.
    I hope that the picture attached will encourage you to continue your work.
    It’s the electronically beta test build model, that I obtained by my SurfMaster 2 fold back ability.
    Best++,
    Emil
  7. yaniv

    yaniv Active Member

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    looks outstending work

    kip going my friend
  8. Lex

    Lex Dollmaker

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    :-o Work by Dr Zarkov is always impressive... Always...

    --Bmer, don't be held back by anything, even if others has already done it in the past, nothing matches a model designed by yourself.
  9. Bmer

    Bmer New Member

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    Wow! Dr. Zarkov, AMAZING WORK!

    Too bad I'll never be able to use surfmaster, $195 is a very hefty price :( .

    What exactly does the plugin do though?

    Also, did you use any of the new 3D capabilities offered by the 2007/2008 versions of AutoCAD, or only your plugin?

    And now my final questions: what do the pink lines on the model denote?

    Once again, amazing work Dr. Zarkov, now I am really looking forward to having some free time so that I can get working on my model too!
  10. Alcides

    Alcides Member

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    Bmer

    In Dr.Zarkov's site you have information about surfmaster:

    http://www.card-models.com/surfmaster.php

    by the way the document is a good introduction to design a paper model, even it's oriented to surfmaster.



    Emil

    Do you say "surfmaster 2"? May be do you have to comment something about that?

    Regards
    Alcides
  11. Bmer

    Bmer New Member

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    Dr. Zarkov, any chance that you have an educational, or "discount" version of your plugin?
  12. Lex

    Lex Dollmaker

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    Just to add one thing surfmaster allows folding a developed part back to its original shape and see how panel lines fit on the model etc, which is not capable by Rhino.
  13. Emil_Zarkov

    Emil_Zarkov Member

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    Hi All,
    The final countdown is running and the new SurfMaster 2 will be announced in a days.
    The bad hews is that its price will be 195 Euro...
    The good news is that there will be considerable discount for education and individuals.
    Despite that I wrote the product, I have limited abilities to control the markets politic of its distributors companies.
    I’ll try to answer in brief to some of the questions found in the previous emails in this tread without quoting them.
    The magenta lines on the drawing represent the edges of the camouflage patterns on the model.
    The SurfMaster 2 can work under AutoCAD from R14 to 2008. It doesn’t use the new 2D geometry of the last versions directly, but they are very convenient for obtaining in 3D the definition lines that SM II uses as a source for surfaces and their cutouts creation. Thus, SM II can work not only under AutoCAD, but also under the far more cheaper IntelliCAD.
    The main functions of the SM II are:
    - Intelligent developable surfaces creation from two definition curves by using some optimization algorithms like a minimum of the integral curvature of the surface for example
    - Unfolding such surfaces
    - Calculating the intersection lines between two surfaces and drawing them both in 3D space and the cutouts
    - Parallel projection of linear drawing objects on the surfaces and drawing the resulting curves both in 3D and cutouts
    - Folding back everything drawn on the cutouts to their corresponding surfaces
    - Set of commands that help creation the definition curves
    - Set of paper modeling tools for automatic generation of connecting stripes and formers
    SM II also is supplied with iTransform option that realize affine and perspective transformations.
    I can post few steps from the Ju-87 design if some interest will be shown.
    Best regards,
    Emil
  14. Billy Leliveld

    Billy Leliveld Member

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    Hello Bmer,
    I can see you have already the attention of one of the finest designers in the world, I just starting designing my first model,the old-fashioned way, using the FG designing without Cad/Cam tutorial,the thread is here; http://www.cardmodels.net/forum/showthread.php?t=8293
    Good luck with your Stuka,(and your exames) post some pictures!
    Cheers, Billy
  15. Bmer

    Bmer New Member

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    Sorry guys, I have been away for a really, really long time...but I did say I had exams :p. Anyways, my next batch are now approximately a month away, so till then, I've got some time on my hands.

    Well, another thing, I've decided to switch to the P-51 D Mustang, because it's a smaller, and simpler plane. The Ju-47 will probably be my next plane, if all goes well with this one.

    Anyways, I have all my source drawings all prepared and everything, with cross-sections, a top/bottom, side, and front view of the plane. I have it all imported as raster images AutoCAD...and now I'm stuck.

    Totally stuck.

    What's my first step? The tutorials for Rhino don't really apply, I've tried googling info on designing card models with AutoCAD, but all I get is Dr. Zarkov's SurfMaster on the hitlist. How do I go about designing a model, by only using ACAD? What should my first steps be?

    I know I could use Wunwinglow's method, if I'm trying to do it all 2-D, but AutoCAD also has 3D capabilities (as Dr. Zarkov's picture shows), but how do I set my model up and stuff to do it his way?

    Dr. Zarkov, your help would be greatly appreciated in this, since you seem to be so skilled with doing this in AutoCAD. But I guess this might also be your trade secret...:p

    Oh well, if you can help, it would be greatly appreciated, if not, trial and error will be the best way to start off I guess.
  16. Maurice

    Maurice Member

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  17. damraska

    damraska Member

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    Dr. Zarkov, this is an incredibly important point, and I am surprised it passed without comment until now.

    In the plastic model world, every modeler gets to decide what paint scheme to use, what markings to apply, how much to accent the shadows, how many dings and scrapes to add, how much soot to rub in, to use or not use photo-etch, to use or not use resin upgrades, and so forth. In the card model world, the designer/artist makes all those decisions in advance. Most card model builders do not have the inclination, time, or skill to scan, repaint, and design detail parts for a model.

    This leaves lots and lots of room for card model designers to work on the exact same subject (i.e., a Ju 87 Stuka), yet create completely different models!

    Frankly, I am surprised designers who sell in electronic format do not release the same subject over and over with different markings, different weathering, and different levels of detail, charging full price every time. The plastic model companies releases the same model over and over with different decals and occasionally some upgrade parts, and people buy them. They buy them to the point they can never build them all, and still they buy. Will card model consumers do the same thing if given the chance?

    I tend to agree with you with regards to gradient fills, especially when used to simulate bare metal surfaces. If a designer forces the lighting in the artwork, he or she really needs to apply the affect consistently throughout the model. If not, the built up model looks wrong, and even then, if lite from the 'wrong' direction, something still looks amiss.

    With regards to beveling and embossing, any beveled panel could just as well be a seperate part, and any depression accentuated with a dropshadow could just as well be a cutout.

    On the other hand, some artists use beveling, embossing, gradient fills, and weathering to create reals works of art. In fact, GPMs Ju 87D-3 is an excellent example of all those techniques used to excellent effect. The finished piece looks like a plastic competition model.

    As you say, there is room for many, many different versions of the same subject. Designers have at it.

    And I am super jazzed to see that Ju 87G on your computer, and what it forebodes.

    Bmer, I look forward to your eventual progress on the Ju 87A-1 as well. Good luck with the Mustang.

    -Doug
  18. paper warrior

    paper warrior Member

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    I agree, although it does happen but isn't very common. Another method would be to just add little modifications to produce variants, at full price.
  19. RyanShort1

    RyanShort1 Member

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    I'd definately be interested!

    Ryan
  20. Emil_Zarkov

    Emil_Zarkov Member

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    Hi All,
    I'll visit USA at Jun 07 to July 06.
    I'll be in Randolf WI and Cleveland OH and probbably on some other places.
    I'm ready to have some speach or presentation of something like "how the things are made" about card models design. It's not so late to organize the event in case of interest shown.
    Any suggestions are wellcome.
    Best++,
    Emil Zarkov, ModelArt Ltd.