Another poll to ponder and raise some eyebrows

[who_dat73]

The next thing on my list is what do you think of "taggers" "Graphity artists" "spray paint punks" or whatever the case may be do you ever get dumbstruck that they can do that with a simple spray can.
I personally would smack them upside the head and ask them what they would think if somone spraypainted stuff all over there auto but I have to admit some of the things I have seen I would nominate to go in a museum as a piece of art.

Now dont get me wrong I agree what they are doing is wrong and should be punished but at the same time some of that stuff amazes me that they can do somthing like that with a can of paint

 

[Ralph]

I don't appreciate spraying paint on property that doesn't belong to the artist but will admit that some of those taggers have real artisitc ability. I grudgingly model grafitti on my Penn Central era layout since it certainly was something I observed on equipment rolling by back in the early 70s. I hated what was done to the NY subway system back then when virtually every surface of the car's outside was covered in paint. I couldn't believe it when we visited relatives in Brooklyn. Personally I'd support stiff fines for vandalism and have the money directed to a grant for painters to create sanctioned murals.

 

[ezdays]

I can't believe than anyone but these taggers themeselves would sanction defacing public and private property. They are criminals just in the fact that they are trespassing on railroad property, nevermind the cost to undo the damage they've caused.

Are they artists? Some of them might be, but no real artist would want their work on surfaces that are destined to get overpainted as quicky as possible. Maybe we could find out how good they really are if they have any real talent if we can get the warden to allow them to have artist's materials in their jail cells. They should all be made to repay society for the damage and eyesores they cause.

If I'm a bit unclear about how I feel on the subject, let me know.

 

[brakie]

Well,I see we have some that think its a art according to the poll..Guess what? Let me know where you live and I will put some graffiti on your car and house.. Then tell me its art work.If anything I bet YOU would call the Police to report this act of vandalism. Get the picture?

It's a criminal act nothing more and nothing less.

 

[zedob]

It's a waste of any talent and it's against the law. I am impressed with what some of those fools can do with a spray bomb, but honestly, most of the time I can barely make out what it is they've painted. I guess there are some maestros and some are hackers. Regardless, it's still against the law.

What gets me is that they must have to have done some preliminary planning. I just can't see someone coming up with something that elaborate on-the-fly. Do they call a project meeting and discuss this weekend's piece of artwork? Do they actually buy all of that paint?

 

[who_dat73]

But Brakie in one instance in town here a buisness hired some kids to do the front of there music store the logo and music notes speakers and what have you in a case like that do you see that as junk to?

That is probly the most point I am looking for here do you ever look at graphity and wonder what kind of talent these kids have.
Dont get me wrong if they drop a tag on anything that ant theyr's like I said offer to give the family car a new paint job and see what they think.

But looking at it from a talent point "on a legal area" say they were hired to do it do you think they have talent? Not the legal not legal point

 

[MilesWestern]

Yeah, It's bad, It makes everything they paint look ugly, with the exception of a few small works done in nothing more than a small paint pen. The really big ones are quite incomperhensible when passing on a moving train, so what's the point, of you can't read it, you've missed your point, from an Art standpoint.

Most of those darn taggers are, to my knowelege 'gang' members, possibly on drugs, and have the same relivance to socitey as the litter that line our streets.

The normal "taggers" are doing this the same reason why a cat might pee on your sofa, to mark territory. That's all.

Like Carnation, Oscar Meyer, Chataeu Martin Wines and pacific fruit express, it's like a rolling billboard for their gang, nothing more. Instead of "Buy Carnation Milk, it's really good for you! or, Chateau Martin Wines, Drink-For goodness sake! They're saying, "yo, join our little gang, it's in the 650 (area code) yo! Big Beater made this tag, and don't you forgit it!"


On another point, I wouldn't buy those grafitti decals or take ones from photo's,draw your own, who knows what those commercial decals might say!

 

[zedob]

Well, disregarding the law for the sake of finding hidden talent...

There is definitely some talent out there, whether it be from an artistic stance, or from a co-ordination point of view. The key is how to tap into it.

However, like I said, alot of it is hard to read or see clearly, which in this case should be mandatory in-oder to convey the artist's feelings, thoughts, or what-ever. What these budding artists forgot is that the only time most people are going to see their work is when it's flying by at a crossing. In that case it can't be too busy or obscure. Basic Grafitti 101.

The art in art is in the composition, which should be appealing to the majority to be truely successful piece. I don't care for the style and would rather not see it and I'd bet that the majority agree with me, but i'm sure there are people who do like it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder..., but who's beholding? From a MRRer point of view, modeling it is appropriate and accurate and in that case I do like it because of it's authenticity. :thumb:

(NOTE: I model an earlier era and don't have these contemporary railroad issues. Grafitti was in it's infancy and the best was mostly "I love Sue"'s, or R&T's, etc. )

Painting, or any artform is strictly technique, which can be learned by most people. How good the technique is performed is proportionate to the amount of practice that has been performed beforehand. "Perfect Practice Makes Perfect". So, if one paints on enough boxcars and covered hoppers and tries to do better each time, which should be the case, one's painting skills will improve. Hopefully, so will their composition capabilities.

Actually, it would be nice to see some of them move onto and into an art related career. I just don't think that they should limit themselves to the grafitti style. I haven't seen too many people with a framed picture of any of that stuff. From a business point of view, if it doesn't sell, it may be called "Art", but everyone knows what it really is.

 

[ezdays]

But Brakie in one instance in town here a buisness hired some kids to do the front of there music store the logo and music notes speakers and what have you in a case like that do you see that as junk to?

That is probly the most point I am looking for here do you ever look at graphity and wonder what kind of talent these kids have.
Dont get me wrong if they drop a tag on anything that ant theyr's like I said offer to give the family car a new paint job and see what they think.

But looking at it from a talent point "on a legal area" say they were hired to do it do you think they have talent? Not the legal not legal point

I'd like to answer this if you don't mind. In the case of the music store, they are getting paid by the person that owns the property, that doesn't equate. I can still look at it and say "that's not art", just as I say about some of this "modern art" stuff that is created by someone splashing paint from a can on a piece of canvas on the floor.

Not many taggers own their own rail cars, nor can I comprehend any railroad in their right mind paying someone to deface their property by spraying "art" all over their resources. No one should look at how great the art is or how talented is the person that did it, just that it's wrong. I for one cannot get past that issue, and that's that. There are many talented people behind bars, those that forge art or money for instance. In those cases I can understand the motive, they get enriched monitarily, but in the case of taggers, their enrichment is an ego boost.

We had a tagger caught a few years ago because he had similar work sketched on his school books and someone turned him in. When they went to his house in a very upscale neighborhood, they found similar work on the backyard wall. Apparently, his parents must have appreciated his much misaligned "talent", but I assure you, no one else did.

 

[MilesWestern]

Wow EZ days, that's quite a story. Perhaps if the railroads made more colorful designs on their cars, maybe it would be less of a problem, because if you look at railroad cars, which are the ones most often tagged: Monochrome Boxcars, followed by single colored (usually white) covered hoppers. If only because it gives the tagger a 'clean canvas' for his work.

 

[who_dat73]

EZ you make a very very good point with the forgers part I never thought of it that way and totaly agree with you.
As far as your comment Miles the RR shouldnt have to paint up the cars just to avoid tagging they need to find a LEGAL way to display they'r ability like EZ pointed out let the parents let them paint the fence at home. and they can spend the money to cover it up..

The reason I brought this up in the first place is that there was a boxer come through town a couple of days ago with a mural of "Jesus" tagged on it and it was in my opinion very beutifull and the fact that the person could get so much detail and make it look so real with a spray can just blew my mind.
But it is a pity that he would offend the good name the the "Lord" in such a illegal way put the picture on canvas I probly would have given him a decint price for it!!!

Also to make it fair I am not limiting the Grap. that is done on a ilegal surface I am talking and spray paint work where they actully make somthing you can recognize not just a signiture.

 

[Relic]

Wow man I must be gettin old,I hadda scroll down an read a few posts to figger out what the subject was.I had a hard time voting on one hand some of that vandalism looks pretty good(better with a head fulla acid) but on the other hand(I have a wart) it,s still vandalism

 

[Catt]

While I agree it is vandalism it is still a fact of modern life art or not.Since I model the present my railroad has grafitti and will have till it disapears from the proto scene.

 

[GeorgeHO]

There will be no graffitti on my railraod EVER.

 

[brakie]

who_dat73,Those painting of music notes,speakers etc was commission by the store owner/manager to do..Graffti is commission by nobody except the Vandals. And there lays the deference.

 

[who_dat73]

Ok I see what you are getting at :thumb:
you are al making very valid points

 

[ezdays]

Ok I see what you are getting at :thumb:
you are al making very valid points

Glad to see you are being converted. It is most difficult to seperate the "artist" and their deeds. For example, could you still admire a rapper for their "music" (sorry for the quotes, but I don't think there is anything musical in rap or hip-hop) if you find they've been involved in a shooting, or that their "music" is all about committing violence to innocent people?

I think that is a fair comparison.

 

[who_dat73]

Glad to see you are being converted. It is most difficult to seperate the "artist" and their deeds. For example, could you still admire a rapper for their "music" (sorry for the quotes, but I don't think there is anything musical in rap or hip-hop) if you find they've been involved in a shooting, or that their "music" is all about committing violence to innocent people?

I think that is a fair comparison.

Actully put the Brakies"pun intended" on there "Sorry couldn't let that slip past"
I am not converting just stating that you all have valid points I never intended to make it look like I thought that the Graph was legal just that some of the murals they could make with a spray can astonded me. WHAT THEY DO IS AGINST THE LAW. plain and simple and they should be punished!!!!!
But somthines I am dumbstruck that these punk kids can make this stuff with a spray can look so good I dont paint my own locos simply because I cant make it look good enuf and they can make somthing that big look like that more then likly in the dark while trying to avoid getting caught.
On the subject of rap I dont listen to most of it because most of the time it talkes about drugs sex and gangs and I just cant understand most of what they are saying but I have listened to one former gang rapper that became a born agin Christian that I think is very good with his anti sin message.:thumb:

 

[ross31r]

arent graphitti artists why american police forces have shoot to kill policies?

 

[Sunburn]

Richard Dawson hosted Art Contest

I agree with most of the posts, tagging is basically peeing on the sofa. I agree that most of it, is a blight.
I also have seen some, that is jaw-dropping. Hey even Sony hired people to tag buildings with PSP propaganda.

It would be interesting to have a art campaign centered around the dead areas on certain freight cars. Have art scholarships on the line. Get people interested in trains again. Upside is, you dont't have to waste a lot of company paint on the car. Have PPG or somesuch sponsor.

Of course the downside is a certain rise in the tagging of ALL rolling stock.

Hey, the winner could get a free vacation to a "Sunny Paradise" (ala Running Man).